DM skills

[divermike1011]

Peter, I don't know much about the Army, I just liked the point that speaker made about using the simplest available means to teach and evaluate. I don't think we'll ever agree on the validity or value to these two specific drills, and that's okay. In fact I am going to take your challenge and make sure I can deploy an SMB whilst hovering a set distance off the bottom, and if I can't I'll work on it until I can.

This thread got me thinking about a couple of items: 1. While I don't agree with everything PADI does or requires, I agree with them enough that I continue to stay within their professional ranks and to me that means following the party line when it comes to teaching, and to be honest I've been asked to do far dumber things while in the Navy, so I really don't spend a lot of time getting worked up over the utility of PADI requirements.

2. In my few months on SB I've made the following generalization about divers from the PNW, and this is as a rule ya'll are really into being the best divers you can be. I envy having a community that seems so focused on going above and beyond minimal diving standards and I think I can pretty safely say that out here on Oahu there isn't quite the same global desire to be technically brilliant at the basics. That isn't to say we don't have a large number of thoughtful divers who strive to be better both in the industry and in our customers, but we don't have the unforgiving conditions you folks do, and probably 80% of our customer base are divers on vacation. Which means my priorities are: 1. Everyone gets back out of the water in the same condition they entered it; 2. Keep idiot divers who did ten dives over the last 20 years from killing themselves on the Sea Tiger (100 fsw dive); and 3. Show my students a good enough time they come back for further instruction, or at least come back to the shop to dive with us.

This seems to be what the vast majority of our market wants. If I broke out a BP/W set-up with long hose I suspect they'd think it was a piece of S&M gear. These guys and gals want to see a sea turtle, take a picture for the Christmas card, and cross breathing underwater off their bucket list.

This means what I want in a DM is someone who is not prone to panic, safe, and has descent people skills. Doing a frog kick two feet off the ground while kicking up zero silt is something I practice because of my own non-professional diving goals, but really isn't applicable to what I do as a dive professional out here.

Wow, sorry that was so long.

Michael

 

[TSandM]

I think this thread has wandered a long way from the original question, which was whether a DM class would improve the OP's diving skills, if he did NOT want to lead dives or assist instructors.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

I think this thread has wandered a long way from the original question, which was whether a DM class would improve the OP's diving skills, if he did NOT want to lead dives or assist instructors.

It depends upon the standard of the agency and how rigorously he gets trained during the DM class and by whom.

 

[WillYanni]

To the OP. Maybe what you are looking for isn't a class at all. Find a Dive Buddy who wants to improve, or better yet find someone who has solid skills and get them to be a mentor.

Then it is like taking a class but free, You will improve as you emulate another (better/stronger) diver, Maybe practice a new skill at the end of every dive.

The best skill that you will ever learn is buoyancy control and comfort in the water, and no one can (actually) teach you that, it comes with practice.

 

[k ellis]

The best skill that you will ever learn is buoyancy control and comfort in the water, and no one can (actually) teach you that, it comes with practice.

Very well said!

 

[randytay]

I
I'm never really understood how a Fundies class is so life changing. If you pass you pass. But then all it shows is that you had good buoyancy in the first place. Could someone explain what makes them so amazing? This is not GUE bashing, I really don't understand.

While there are skills and techniques that are new and difficult in all other endeavours of diving, eg tech, cave, rebreather etc. Why does the fundies course stand out?
Bear in mind that the simple of answer of 'just take one and see' is not likely as I don't agree with the equipment mantra.

The mango is sweet. It is not sweet like the orange or strawberries, or grapes or honeydew. But it is sweet. But if you have not tasted it and not willing to taste it, you will never know what a mango taste like except hearing that it is sweet.

In all seriousness, IMO the fundies or essentials course stand out because you have already learned diving but now you are taught to do diving in another way, placing certain skills like buoyancy and trim before other basic skills. Tech and caves are merely building on top of the essentials and fundies, not really doing something totally different so it comes a transition.

IMHO, there is no equipment mantra; they have a reason why they do it and you can try it out before you decide if you agree, or in your case, disagree.

 

[Ste Wart]

The mango is sweet. It is not sweet like the orange or strawberries, or grapes or honeydew. But it is sweet. But if you have not tasted it and not willing to taste it, you will never know what a mango taste like except hearing that it is sweet.

In all seriousness, IMO the fundies or essentials course stand out because you have already learned diving but now you are taught to do diving in another way, placing certain skills like buoyancy and trim before other basic skills. Tech and caves are merely building on top of the essentials and fundies, not really doing something totally different so it comes a transition.

IMHO, there is no equipment mantra; they have a reason why they do it and you can try it out before you decide if you agree, or in your case, disagree.

Fruit analogies don't work for me. Try a Durian fruit and you'll see why there is no need to sample everything in this world.

Seriously though.
There's just no call for me to consider the course, that's why I ask for an accurate description. There's so many things I want to do in diving and Fundies are not on that list. I've got a pretty good path that I want to be on (CCR eventually ) and shelling out for a Fundies when I want to buy an Inspiration is not going to help.

 

[TSandM]

All I can say, wart, is that my friend Rick Inman took Fundamentals with me, and went on to do IANTD technical training through CCR. His tech instructor told him the very BEST foundation he could have had for his further training was the Fundamentals class. Really solidifying basic skills to a very high level of polish, and maintaining them without conscious thought, so that your brain is available to handle other issues, is a good basis for any more advanced diving, I think.

 

[Ste Wart]

All I can say, wart, is that my friend Rick Inman took Fundamentals with me, and went on to do IANTD technical training through CCR. His tech instructor told him the very BEST foundation he could have had for his further training was the Fundamentals class. Really solidifying basic skills to a very high level of polish, and maintaining them without conscious thought, so that your brain is available to handle other issues, is a good basis for any more advanced diving, I think.

Yes, but we are talking about my path here. I already have Full Trimix. I'm not going to take a fundies course before CCR am I?

 

[Trace Malinowski]

Yes, but we are talking about my path here. I already have Full Trimix. I'm not going to take a fundies course before CCR am I?

Wart,

Divers often view training as a hierarchical progression of levels. The thought of taking a class that is "beneath" another is somehow viewed as climbing down the ladder rather than up. In other sports, no matter how good an athlete is, that athlete accepts coaching in fundamentals.

For example, Tom Brady, the quarterback for the New England Patriots American football team was asked what notes he was reviewing prior to the Super Bowl. He told the sports reporter that he was reviewing the fundamentals of throwing a pass. "C" grip on ball. Front arm straight. Smooth release and follow-through on the throw. He said that if he could start the game with good passing fundamentals that might give his team the edge.

In college lacrosse, my coach always returned to the fundamentals every few weeks. We'd go over everything as if we had never done it before.

Having been an experienced diver before taking GUE-F, I can attest to what the skills will do for your diving. As an instructor, mastery of the skills you'll learn in GUE-F will set you leagues apart from your competition. Every time I work with GUE instructor friends, I get good coaching and feedback to maintain the highest possible degree of control.

That's the strength of GUE - the best peak performance buoyancy and propulsion course in the world. The weakness of GUE is that this degree of control becomes a one-trick pony throughout all levels of training. You never really learn to dive, you learn to look good while diving. That's where instructors with experience and open minds then begin to surpass a rigid system. You can take near-perfect physical skills and combine them with thinking both inside the DIR box and outside the DIR box applying what is best for each situation.

For CCR, a GUE-F class would dial in perfect technique while a freediving class would help you resort to freediving tricks to maintain buoyancy with your lungs removed from the buoyancy control equation and buy you time to adjust with the BC on the rebreather. Going back to such fundamentals before a big training progression is how athletes in other sports do it.