Diving with a Pony - key tips for a newbie?

[JohnN]

Doesn't really matter I stopped transiting the US a few years ago. I now take my business to the Far East.

Back to the OP's question: I fitted an extra D-ring to the jacket so a 3Lt pony runs down my right front with the reg clipped-off to a D-ring on my right shoulder, the hose is held to the cylinder by bungee and can just pull out when required.

I practice at least once a year, from 30-35m, switching over to the pony, deploying an DSMB and making a direct ascent.

So what about a reference for your statement that R&R'ing a tank valve puts stress on the threads?

 

[JohnN]

Oh sure, if you have no issues violating airline policy because you probably won't get caught because the airline doesn't check, then sure, you can do whatever you want. You can also cheat on your taxes and probably get away with that too, and you can get to your destination faster if you break the speed limit. Other people take things further and put masks on their faces and a gun in their hand and walk into banks and demand money.

This isn't about intelligence it's about honesty.

LMAO

 

[Lorenzoid]

This isn't about intelligence it's about honesty.

I can't tell if you're being serious or facetious. This isn't like breaking a law--it's an airline baggage fee rule. How would the average dive traveler be expected to know about an airline's idiosyncratic rules regarding special fees that depend upon what's inside his bags? This is an airline we're talking about, not TSA, not Customs. If I understood JohnN's point, the average traveler assumes the airline doesn't care what in his bags, because for the most part, they don't. Sure, if the gate agent asks, "Do you have a ________ in your bag?" (scuba cylinder or whatever else) then I would answer truthfully. Otherwise, I don't think it's cheating. Ignorance maybe. But for what I read in this thread, it would not have occurred to me that an airline would care what's in my bag when I check in for a flight.

If this were about breaking a law, I might feel differently. I once bought something abroad for which I knew I would be required to pay a Customs duty. I diligently filled out the form and declared what I bought, and when I went to pay the duty the Customs official seemed surprised at my honesty. They have no idea what you bought or didn't buy abroad that you're carrying home with you--it's basically the honor system. She actually thanked me for my honesty. But that's the law, not some goofy airline baggage rule that few travelers could be expected to be aware of.

 

[Edward3c]

So what about a reference for your statement that R&R'ing a tank valve puts stress on the threads?

I'l have to find a Public reference as I learned about it in a confidential environment. I've more important things to do at the moment.

 

[idocsteve]

I can't tell if you're being serious or facetious.

I get a lot of that.

 

[2airishuman]

I'd be grateful for some tips on what to focus on

There have been fatalities where people using back-mounted pony cylinders inadvertently started the dive on the pony cylinder then ran out of air early in the dive when the pony cylinder was exhausted. If you experiment with a back-mounted pony cylinder, be aware of this possibility, and be sure your rig is set up to minimize the chances of such an accident. I believe sling-mounted pony cylinders are safer, and that is what I use. I carry mine charged and off.

Mainly you will want to practice your gear setup, water entry, and switching to the pony in an emergency. You will also want to figure out whether you have to change your weights. Depending on your setup you may need to move some weights from one side to another and will probably need a little less weight overall. You will also want to practice an ascent while using the pony cylinder, keeping in mind that you will have to orally inflate the BC at the surface.

On the travel questions, some of the better operators will provide you a pony cylinder for a small fee if you ask in advance. I've never flown with mine but I know many people have. In the USA you are supposed to remove the valve, and it's common to cover the cylinder opening with tape to prevent entrance of any debris. I have no idea what the rules are elsewhere.

I put scuba gear in my luggage all the time and have never had to pay a special fee. I think those rules date from another era when people used bulkier gear overall and packed primary cylinders into their dive bag.

(and why is it called a pony...?)

Because it's smaller than the primary cylinder. In U.S. English in the 1950s, "pony" was a common marketing term for a smaller version of anything being sold.

 

[Mat K]

There have been fatalities where people using back-mounted pony cylinders inadvertently started the dive on the pony cylinder then ran out of air early in the dive when the pony cylinder was exhausted. If you experiment with a back-mounted pony cylinder, be aware of this possibility, and be sure your rig is set up to minimize the chances of such an accident. I believe sling-mounted pony cylinders are safer, and that is what I use. I carry mine charged and off.

Mainly you will want to practice your gear setup, water entry, and switching to the pony in an emergency. You will also want to figure out whether you have to change your weights. Depending on your setup you may need to move some weights from one side to another and will probably need a little less weight overall. You will also want to practice an ascent while using the pony cylinder, keeping in mind that you will have to orally inflate the BC at the surface.

On the travel questions, some of the better operators will provide you a pony cylinder for a small fee if you ask in advance. I've never flown with mine but I know many people have. In the USA you are supposed to remove the valve, and it's common to cover the cylinder opening with tape to prevent entrance of any debris. I have no idea what the rules are elsewhere.

I put scuba gear in my luggage all the time and have never had to pay a special fee. I think those rules date from another era when people used bulkier gear overall and packed primary cylinders into their dive bag.



Because it's smaller than the primary cylinder. In U.S. English in the 1950s, "pony" was a common marketing term for a smaller version of anything being sold.

Thanks so much for the reply, really helpful especially about moving around some weight. I'm probably going to change the hose to white or red to minimize error. Having scoured the boards on the topic, I'm planning to go for sling mounting. However, I'm going to have to tinker as my BC (right now) only has one spare D ring on each side - webbing D ring is on order.

I had no idea the flying with a pony would trigger so much 'debate'. Regs always go in my carry-on. I'd probably try the same with a smaller pony tank.

 

[glassbottom]

Thanks so much for the reply, really helpful especially about moving around some weight. I'm probably going to change the hose to white or red to minimize error.

Good idea. My only suggestion would be to stay away from colors that are primarily used to indicate certain mixes unless you are using them for those mixes.

For example green like this one

Dive Rite O2 DECO Regulator, DIN


Personally i just use a regular spare regulator (its a Mk2+G250 graphite+button spg i had laying around) The whole reg is banded/strapped to the bottle (which is yellow) so its pretty hard for me to mistake for my octo.

I only use it when either practicing in springs or diving with unproven, thus untrusted buddies (ie: insta-buddies) because ive been left more times than im comfortable admitting.

 

[ReefHound]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but airlines do not open your bags. TSA (insert foreign security here) does. The airline has no way of knowing what is in your bag and once it is checked, their obligation is to get it to your destination.

This isn't complicated, you apparently failed the test

So if the airlines don't open bags and don't know what's in bags, what does it matter if the tank is in a bag with clothes or a bag with dive gear?

Also, I see absolutely nothing in the clause you cites that says the tank must be IN a bag. I interpreted it to mean there is a service charge for transporting tanks separately, not in a bag.

The entire clause concerning dive bags is irrelevant as it basically just a bag that counts toward your allowance with the same weight and size restrictions. I think it is a relic from the past when airlines allowed an *additional* piece of sporting equipment that could be oversized or overweight. Some airlines still do. Airlines with a Free Scuba Equipment Allowance

 

[macado]

Its the removing and refitting the valve that causes the most stress that can result in the tank threads failure.

Yeah..That's mostly horse manure.. If you were referring to the tapered pipe thread fittings found on other compressed gas cylinders then I would maybe agree. Tapered threads could become damaged by constantly removing and refitting the valve.

On modern SCUBA cylinders the tank neck o-ring is what makes the seal. The only way the threads are going to get damaged is by cross threading, galvanic corrosion or maybe severe over torquing.

To expand on this further (at least for people in the Unites States, I don't know UK regulations), specific to US/DOT in CFR 178.46, 3AL cylinders must have 6 concurrent undamaged threads engaged.

https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2014-title49-vol3/pdf/CFR-2014-title49-vol3-sec178-46.pdf

Catalina requires 8 minimum threads for 3000psi and 9 for 3500psi.
Minimum Number of Threads Required in SCUBA Cylinders - Catalina Cylinders