DIR- Generic Diver attitude! Be careful, experienced divers...

[The Chairman]

where do we draw the line?

With ourselves. With only ourselves. We're not the dive or cave police. Dive and let dive. I only give advice if I'm asked for it.

 

[Celt]

The rig I mentioned above had at least 5 second stages as a couple of recreational reg sets with consoles had been attached to the twinset. I think the 'deco' stage had a recreational set with one reg and a SPG.

Picturing that rig I would ask myself why?

 

[Litefoot]

Obviously this guy wasn’t changing his configuration at that point no matter what @Wibble or anyone else would have suggested. I’m too busy setting up and checking my own gear to notice anyone else’s stuff. But if I do see someone about to launch into the deep with something obviously wrong (releases unfastened, bc not inflated, hose tangled/kinked, etc) I’m going to say something. I don’t care if they’re pissed off about it.

 

[tursiops]

But if I do see someone about to launch into the deep with something obviously wrong (releases unfastened, bc not inflated, hose tangled/kinked, etc) I’m going to say something. I don’t care if they’re pissed off about it.

Exactly. "Dive and Let Dive" is a silly statement, even though well-intended. It implies we are each little islands, unconnected, with no mutual consequences of our actions. Wrong. If a guy dies on a dive boat that trip is over, which affects me. If a few words could have prevented that death, it is my self-interest (not to mention the interest of the recipient of those words) to speak them. So the issue is when to say something and when to shut up; the answer is not to always shut up. If a diver is about ready to jump and he doesn't have fins on, it is likely not a safety issue but rather an embarrassment issue. But if the diver does not have a connected LPI hose, it is worth mentioning. Judgement calls. You never need to be an a** about it, just a gentle word or two.

 

[jborg]

I don't think I've ever received unwelcome unsolicited advice. For example there was the time my backup light had become unclipped and was just attached to the webbing with the inner tube holding it in place. I would likely have lost it at splash time if the dude on the opposite side of the boat hadn't pointed it out. Very welcome unsolicited advice.

Another time, I spent an entire dive at 4°C with a leaking dry glove. I thought it was punctured somewhere. Came up, drained the water from my arm, complained about freezing cold. The person next to me on the boat pointed out I'd gotten the washing instructions tab on my inner glove stuck in between the glove rings on the outside of my arm. He'd seen it before we splashed "but didn't want to say anything." Yeah, thanks... (I cut that **** off real quick.)

If we're on the same boat, please feel free to point out silly mistakes in my setup before I hit the water. I paid for that dive and will happily swallow a few seconds of embarrassment to not have it ruined.

 

[Wibble]

...So the issue is when to say something and when to shut up; the answer is not to always shut up. If a diver is about ready to jump and he doesn't have fins on, it is likely not a safety issue but rather an embarrassment issue. But if the diver does not have a connected LPI hose, it is worth mentioning. Judgement calls. You never need to be an a** about it, just a gentle word or two.

Errors, which is when someone's forgotten their fins, drysuit connector... are not really challenging. They fall into the "being helpful" category for which nobody should have an issue.

Commenting upon someone's dangerous -- in "our" opinion -- rig is a completely different matter. That person may be perfectly safe diving like that (e.g. @Celt's inverted stage between the twinset).

My moral challenge was that the rig looked simply awful, literally regs everywhere. But who am I to pontificate from on high to say that their rig is "dangerous" (even though it patently was). Similarly, you cannot assess someone's water skills on a boat. You can question them about their rig and skills, but you cannot interrogate them about them!

If that were a "club boat" charter, it would be a different issue altogether as the club Dive Officer may have a duty of care to that person.

As it was an independent diver boat; nobody but that diver are responsible for their kit and caboodle.

Nobody would have predicted that outcome. Alas nobody was surprised at the outcome either.

 

[Rick Brant]

Not sure what the vibe on the boat was but on my usual boat someone saying "that's not PADI standard" would have been making fun of PADI rather than pointing out a perceived deficiency in someone's gear.

 

[jborg]

Not sure what the vibe on the boat was but on my usual boat someone saying "that's not PADI standard" would have been making fun of PADI rather than pointing out a perceived deficiency in someone's gear.

I think the expected reply around here would be something like "Indeed..." accompanied by nodding sagely.

That said, I think it is PADI standard, to the extent that is a thing.

The primary regulator has a two-metre/seven-foot hose for sharing gas with a teammate in an emergency. The secondary regulator is independent for use in case of malfunction in the primary regulator. The secondary is also used when sharing gas with a teammate via the primary regulator.

(I'm going to gloss right over the "high capacity BCD with a backup gas bladder" there though...)

 

[crofrog]

What about something more objectively dangerous. Say someone with a tank of 36% planning on doing a 150ft dive... Would you attempt to stop them?

 

[tursiops]

What about something more objectively dangerous. Say someone with a tank of 36% planning on doing a 150ft dive... Would you attempt to stop them?

I would not physically intervene, but I'd surely say something to them. If they ignore me, I'd say something to the boat operator.