Dive buddy for air? No thanks.

[TSandM]

When was the last time an OW diver, diving in OW, drowned from an OOA situation?

I know of at least five in the last three years in the Seattle area. Two were diving solo, one got separated from his buddies on a deep dive, one got separated from his buddies on a very deep dive, possibly during a rescue attempt, and one initiated an air-share at 100 fsw but was unable to execute it and separated from her buddy on ascent, and ended up embolizing. (BTW, NONE of those cases had anything to do with equipment failure. They ran out of gas.)

What the last story told me was that, if you are going to depend on your buddy for your spare gas, you had better practice sharing gas, AND getting to the surface calmly WHILE sharing gas.

I am very lucky that I travel with my own dive buddy or buddies. If I traveled alone and dove often with strangers, I would seriously consider slinging a spare bottle.

 

[seaducer]

When was the last time an OW diver, diving in OW, drowned from an OOA situation?

According to the DAN 2007 Accident Report (2008 has not been made available yet):

- Diver on scuba for his third dive of the day, lost by buddies from the beginning. Diver was
found at the bottom with his tank turned off.
- Diver was witnessed trying to reach his spare regulator immediately after descent. His main tank was empty.​

There were other cases where a pony bottle or having a buddy with an octo may have helped. A guy on a rebreather who went hypoxic when he failed to open his bottles, perhaps, if that diver had bailout gas available and recognized the signs, I don't know all the details on that case though.​

Several more cases where the divers were never recovered, but it is possible they drowned for OOA.​

In any case, in 2007 there were certainly 2 cases of OW divers drowning because of an OOA situation, and those were simply the cases DAN is aware of.​

Of course we could further question, aside from fatalities from OOA, how many rapid ascents that result, or nearly result in DCS or embolism might have been prevented if the diver had carried a bailout bottle, or was diving with a competent and attentive buddy?
Planning a redundant air supply, whether you carry it, or your buddy carries it and you dive as a team, seems prudent to me. YMMV​

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I know of at least five in the last three years in the Seattle area. Two were diving solo, one got separated from his buddies on a deep dive, one got separated from his buddies on a very deep dive, possibly during a rescue attempt, and one initiated an air-share at 100 fsw but was unable to execute it and separated from her buddy on ascent, and ended up embolizing. (BTW, NONE of those cases had anything to do with equipment failure. They ran out of gas.)

What the last story told me was that, if you are going to depend on your buddy for your spare gas, you had better practice sharing gas, AND getting to the surface calmly WHILE sharing gas.

I am very lucky that I travel with my own dive buddy or buddies. If I traveled alone and dove often with strangers, I would seriously consider slinging a spare bottle.

I can think of at least a dozen in the past eight years right here in Puget Sound ... several of them known to me and a couple were former SB members.

It's easy to get to deep recreational depths here, even on simple shore dives. Typically poor vis makes it easy for dive buddies to get separated. And a lot of these people are either very inexperienced ... the last one was on his 12th dive overall, and second after having been AOW certified ... or they're more experienced divers who are just not thinking. The woman in the article Doc appended above was a reasonably experienced diver who just didn't think through her dive plan and didn't take nearly enough gas for the dive she attempted.

It happens too often ... fortunately, the majority of OOA's do not end up in fatalities because someone is there to bail out the diver in need of air.

As far as redundant sources go ... if you're gonna carry one, make sure you've practiced (in the shallows and in the presence of a dive buddy) how to deploy it. And always make sure prior to the start of your dive that the reg is deployable. One fatality here a few years back was due to a diver who was relying on a pony bottle ... but when it came time to deploy it, he had inadvertently trapped his reg and couldn't. Since he was diving solo, there wasn't an alternative ... he drowned with a full pony bottle on his back.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Teamcasa]

Ok, got your attention

My question is if you were starting from scratch designing a protocol to address the out of air diver would it make sense to use your dive buddy?

The concept of redundancy for critical equipment in recreational diving breaks down with the rubber O-ring.

So, why not use a truly redundant system for recreational diving?

This is not rocket science. If you run OOA, (forget arguing all of the reasons to prevent it, panic situations, et al.) you need air fast. If your buddy is closer than the surface, most will just go there otherwise, up you go. Buddies are your life line, it just does not get any easier than that.

As for redundant air supplies, if you bring it and find you need it then all of the arguments against it diminish considerably. Even the most strident detractors of Spare Air will happily gulp a breath or more if that was the only thing available.

As for redundancy, my buddy is first, alternate gear a distant second.

 

[Web Monkey]

Ok, got your attention

My question is if you were starting from scratch designing a protocol to address the out of air diver would it make sense to use your dive buddy?

The concept of redundancy for critical equipment in recreational diving breaks down with the rubber O-ring.

So, why not use a truly redundant system for recreational diving?

It's a pretty well-thought-out problem with only a few solutions. Are you thinking of anything different than the currently available solutions (buddy, pony, doubles, spare air )?

Terry

 

[DiverBizz]

I dive with a redundant (my favorite buddy) 19 cu. ft. because I don't have a regular dive buddy. I have not needed to use it for OOA situation but I practice with it just in case.

 

[tna9001]

Thanks for the response.

The question I have is why do we rely on another diver for the most important piece of support gear? Is it because thats how its always been done it?

In my previous professional life many of the questions that start with "why" are answered that way. It works but its not the best way to approach a challenging question.

If the standard was for each diver to have redundant air and someone had the idea to rely on the "buddy" system instead what kind of response would the diving community have?

 

[Peter Guy]

The OP asked

So, why not use a truly redundant system for recreational diving?

A "real" buddy IS a truly redundant system for recreational diving because a REAL Buddy can help you with:

a. Maintaining max depth limits;
b. Maintaining time limits;
c. Accurate navigation;
d. Spotting the pretty fishies;
e. Extricating from an entanglement;
f. Being an additional source of gas;
g. And on and on.

IF there is a problem with having your dive buddy as your redundant source of everything, it is because so little time is actually spent in teaching people how to be a TRUE dive BUDDY. Although the OW instructor will tell the student "Stay within easy reaching distance of your buddy" more likely than not it won't be strictly enforced, especially in pool sessions!, and, unfortunately, the students may not get the skills needed to actually be able to stay within easy reaching distance of each other.

As most of us know, it ain't easy being a "good buddy" because it does require both divers to be able to manage their own diving in addition to managing to maintain "situational awareness" which means using quite a bit of bandwidth. Most new divers barely have enough bandwidth to maintain awareness of their own situation, let alone their buddies and everything else. It is something that is developed with time and effort.

BUT, I think most classes could do better in giving their new students practical tips on how to be a good buddy.

 

[shoredivr]

As far as redundant sources go ... if you're gonna carry one, make sure you've practiced (in the shallows and in the presence of a dive buddy) how to deploy it. And always make sure prior to the start of your dive that the reg is deployable. One fatality here a few years back was due to a diver who was relying on a pony bottle ... but when it came time to deploy it, he had inadvertently trapped his reg and couldn't. Since he was diving solo, there wasn't an alternative ... he drowned with a full pony bottle on his back.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Thanks for posting that, Bob...another illustration of why slinging a redundant tank is better than back mounting it.

 

[BioLogic]

There are several reasons I rely on my buddy as my redundant air supply:

1) He's a highly reliable system. We stay close, pay attention, and practice sharing.

2) I'm a small woman. Carrying a complete redundant air system would significantly increase the difficulty level of me managing my own gear, climbing in and out, etc. without doing myself injury. It would also increase the difficulty of managing in currents due to added resistance. (I've never used one of these systems so maybe this is not significant -- but as a cyclist, I have hatred for unnecessary drag.)

3) Given that my diving at this time is mostly shallow and not tricky (low visibility is the only thing I'd call a real difficulty), and given the commitment my buddy and I have to checking and cross-checking our equipment before each dive, I judge my risk of needing redundant air is low.

But at the heart of it, there's really only one significant answer to the question. To me, not carrying my own redundant air an acceptable risk.