Dive Boat (and my) Mistake...

[FLTRI]

Thanks for posting and I'm glad it turned out okay.

I'm curious about your statement above, though. It's not like you'd be ratting out a friend when you're in grade school. This is a business, and it should be taken seriously. Not sure what it is that is the big secret, and IMO there shouldn't be one. It sounds like you weren't "upset" because you've taken a lot of the responsibility on yourself (and appropriately so, there are things you've learned from this). But that doesn't absolve the DM from the responsibility selecting appropriate dive sites for the divers in the group (and dive #5 to 105' is not appropriate) and giving a full and proper briefing, including boat procedures, signals, and so on. You got poor service, regardless of whatever mistakes you might have made, and failure to point that out only serves to ensure that that level of service continues.

Off the soapbox. Again. I'm glad you learned from this.

-kari

Couple of reasons, actually. She was obviously "junior" on the boat, the other divemaster and captain were in charge. She asked many questions of them both on the van ride to the dock, and while on the boat. I felt it served no purpose to tell her superiors (her boss) that she set my gear up on an empty bottle. Secondly, the apologies were genuine, she meant it.

I felt that she learned something too, check your customers gauges, they may not be. I think she realized how this could have gone very bad, had the older, inexperienced diver gotten my tank. And you're right, I was more than a little surprised they let him go that deep, in a pretty healthy current, with only five dives under his belt...

While it is my mistake, on the boat I regularly dive in Kauai, the captain or dive master checks every diver out right before they go in. I've watched them open closed valves more than once...

 

[Karibelle]

I guess it's better to be lucky than good?

 

[paddler3d]

I'm glad all worked out for you. Seriously.

Never trust that anyone has set up your gear correctly. Always assume they were busy and distracted and they did it wrong. If someone else set it up, make sure everything works and it tight.

You had a whistle and that was great. I would suggest that you make it part of your BC somehow, is a safety sausage or SMB.

Buddy system, shumuddy system. Don't count on a buddy. You're brain is hands down your most important piece of equipment. Don't forget to use it.

 

[Bubbletrubble]

Thanks for sharing your story. It's a nice reminder for both newbies and experienced divers of what can go wrong on a dive. Glad you were able to surface safely. You didn't panic, you got the attention of the DM, and you ascended safely. No one was hurt. What was your buddy doing while all of this was occurring? Just curious.

My take on the half-filled tank situation is similar to awap's. Who's responsible for ensuring that a full tank is mounted onto your BCD? Is it the person who assembles it (DM, crew) or the diver actually using the gear? In my mind, the diver is 100% responsible for checking his own tank pressure prior to splashing. Period.

Following Dive #1 on a boat, after my tank is re-filled or the tank is swapped out, I'll typically pressurize the reg, check the SPG, and then close off the tank valve. Then, when we arrive at the site for Dive #2, I'll open up the tank valve, check the SPG, verify that both primary and octo/backup regs work while watching the SPG, don the rig, complete my own pre-dive check, do my buddy check, and then walk to the back of the boat where I'll be entering the water. Prior to splashing in, I check my SPG, watch the SPG as I breathe off of my primary, give an OK sign to both my buddy and the DM, and finally splash in. I flash the OK sign back to the boat (provided that a negative entry isn't being conducted). I get together with my buddy at the surface and we descend down a line or do a free descent (depending on conditions). Once I arrive at depth, I once again check my SPG, verify that my weight pockets are in place, my reg is functioning normally, and then give the OK sign to my buddy. Sounds like a fairly comprehensive pre-dive routine, right? Well, about a year ago, I was doing Dive #3 off of a boat...and I forgot to zip up my rear-entry drysuit prior to splashing in. Not fun in 58°F water. We're all human, and we'll all make mistakes. Checking/re-checking critical dive elements and cross-checking with a buddy minimize the chances of making any truly disastrous errors.

I'd also like to bring up the point that this was a striking failure in the buddy system. One critical pre-dive check is to verify the starting pressure for your buddy. The fact that your buddy wasn't aware of your gas status is surprising...particularly considering that you are carrying his emergency reserve. On a related note, did you check how much gas was in your buddy's tank prior to the dive in question? He's carrying your gas reserve, you know.

FWIW, I think the DM responded appropriately when you gave her the low-on-air signal. She offered her octo. That's what she's supposed to do. To clarify your gas status, I guess you could have simply showed your SPG to her. Then, she would have realized why you wanted to ascend immediately. She ascended with you and made sure you got back on the boat safely. In my opinion, the half-filled tank was a minor mistake that should have been caught in even the most cursory of pre-dive checks. I'd dive with that DM any day.

BTW, if you plan to do boat dives in the future, at the bare minimum, your safety gear should consist of a safety sausage and a signaling mirror in addition to the whistle.

Once again, thanks for sharing your story. Have fun out there and be safe...

 

[scubadada]

First off, I've been diving for 15 years, and have right at 100 dives. I'm PADI Advanced Open Water Certified and do most of my diving in Hawaii. My wife and I have been coming to the Islands for about 10 years, and we actually got married off the south shore of Kauai on a dive boat three years ago.

So, here's what happened yesterday.

I charter a two tank boat dive yesterday with an operator I picked at random. They had a nice website, and were close to the hotel. They picked me up at the hotel, and made a few other stops to get three other divers. Once we get to the dock, turns out the battery is dead on the boat. The Captain messes with a battery charger for half and hour, and still can't get it started. I noticed the cabin lights were on, and very dim, and suggested that the battery may charge faster if he turned them off. He shuts them down (they had apparently been left on overnight, draining the battery), and after another half hour, the diesel finally turns over, and we head out.

No big deal, things happen.

Next, we really don't have a dive briefing. One dive master asks if I'm okay at 105' and says we're diving on a airplane, and don't touch the eels. Then, both dive masters suit up and jump in. They swim around the boat for a bit locating the mooring line and tie off the boat. Again, no big deal, figured they'd come back aboard to brief and explain the site more. But, they just motion for the four of us to jump in. We do, and start down.

Again, no big deal, good vis and a neat wreck. They did, however fail to mention there was a pretty good current on the way down, and getting there was a workout.

Again, no big deal.

Next site is at 35-45'and they did brief us a bit more on it than they did on the first dive. They also switched out everyone's gear. We go in, and on decent, I check my air, 1300# We were shallow, so I stayed with the group for about 5 minutes. I finally get one of the divemasters attention, and signal I'm low on air, need to surface, and ask which direction the boat is. She doesn't get what I'm asking and hands me her octopus. I decline as I'm still at 900# and 35 feet but let her know I need to do a controlled accent, and find the boat.

We go up together, and the boat is at least 1/4 mile away. Neither of us have a safety sausage, but I have a whistle. Took a about 10 minutes to get the captains attention, but he finally see's us and picks us up.

She asks me what happened,and I tell her I had an empty tank. She assures me she switched it and I say I know, I watched you do it.

Now, I know The majority of fault lies on me. I didn't check the pressure prior to going in. It's my gear, and I'm responsible for it. Nothing bad came of it other than an aborted dive.

What troubles me is one of the divers was on his 5th dive, and is 67 years old. I kinda watched over him a bit on the first dive, and while he did well, I don't think he looked at his reg once. He more or less just did what the rest of us did, and surfaced with us. Had he gotten the empty bottle, it could have ended poorly.

My divemaster apologized half a dozen times, and I told her I wasn't upset. I also let her know it was between her and I, and I wasn't going to mention it to the other divemaster or captain.

I've never had this happen before, but even after 100 dives, I'll never go in without checking the "new" bottle again...

I rarely post without reading the entire thread. Sorry, the underfilled tank was entirely your responsibility. You should have checked your tank pressure and exchanged your tank for a full one. The rest of the story is not applicable, a rationalization for your irresponsible behavior. You should also be prepared with adequate signaling devices, your bad. Diving is personal responsibiliy, accept it.

Good diving, Craig

 

[mjatkins]

FWIW, I think the DM responded appropriately when you gave her the low-on-air signal. She offered her octo. That's what she's supposed to do. To clarify your gas status, I guess you could have simply showed your SPG to her. Then, she would have realized why you wanted to ascend immediately. She ascended with you and made sure you got back on the boat safely. In my opinion, the half-filled tank was a minor mistake that should have been caught in even the most cursory of pre-dive checks. I'd dive with that DM any day.

Just curious if that was a misstatement or not. A DM should offer her octopus when you signal that you are low on air, or did you mean when you signal that you are out of air? Just curious, as I would expect that a "low on air" tank pressure would have been decided and voiced during the briefing, and is cause to end the dive, not require an alternate airsource ascent. I am familiar with the way we do things in my neck 'o the woods, and am curious if this is a standard practice in other places.

The consensus is right that the OP is responsible for not catching the mistake, but without assigning blame, there are many lessons that the DM has hopefully learned from this. Such as; if you are dealing with someones gear, always check the tank that you are providing them with. You must carry a visual alert, such as an SMB, no excuse! When gearing up, make a point to ask the divers to check their tanks.

I wonder, the junior DM aside, did anyone mention the inappropriateness of the "senior" DM taking a 5 dive diver to this site, or will it happen again tomorrow?

 

[ReefHound]

Just curious if that was a misstatement or not. A DM should offer her octopus when you signal that you are low on air, or did you mean when you signal that you are out of air? Just curious, as I would expect that a "low on air" tank pressure would have been decided and voiced during the briefing, and is cause to end the dive, not require an alternate airsource ascent.

If I am leading a group as a DM and someone signals low on air (and it has happened more than once), I will not whip out the octo and start handing it off right away but it will definitely cross my mind as I get their pressure reading. You just never know what someone means by "low on air". Maybe they mean they are at the pressure you talked about, or maybe they forgot and let it fall below that, or maybe they mean the needle is pretty close to zero but they are still breathing thus not OOA yet. So my initial assumption on a LOA signal is that they may be on their last breath until I know otherwise.

 

[Bubbletrubble]

Just curious if that was a misstatement or not. A DM should offer her octopus when you signal that you are low on air, or did you mean when you signal that you are out of air? Just curious, as I would expect that a "low on air" tank pressure would have been decided and voiced during the briefing, and is cause to end the dive, not require an alternate airsource ascent. I am familiar with the way we do things in my neck 'o the woods, and am curious if this is a standard practice in other places.

@mjatkins: No, it wasn't a misstatement. I've always been of the mind that when my buddy's gas status is ambiguous/uncertain, then it's best to just offer an alternative air source. On a related note, I always thought it was rather funny that my PADI OW books instructed an out-of-air diver to first signal "out-of-air" and then signal "share air." Obviously, if I'm out-of-air, I need to obtain an alternate air source, right?

If I give a low-on-air signal, I would hope that my buddy or DM would first offer his/her alternate air source to me. Then we could figure out how to proceed, i.e., accept/not accept shared air, abort dive, fix issue, etc. I think this course of action is probably better than just assuming no air share since the low-on-air signal is still a little ambiguous. Does it mean 500 psi, 300 psi, 100 psi, just barely above 0 psi? Also, depending on the depth at which the low-on-air signal is given and other factors, it might make sense to share air for a little while and then have the recipient return to his back-gas at some point during the ascent. At the very least, it's safer for the low-on-air diver to maintain some gas in his tank in case the two divers are separated during the ascent (buoyancy problems?). Those are just my thoughts on the matter. I realize that various agencies might teach different things. As with all things, it's best to discuss this with a buddy during pre-dive planning.

So my initial assumption on a LOA signal is that they may be on their last breath until I know otherwise.

If I were a DM, that's what my initial take on the situation would be.

 

[Karibelle]

If I were a DM, that's what my initial take on the situation would be.

That seems like a reasonable initial take if you haven't briefed your group on what the signals are and when to give them... so in the case cited, makes some sense I suppose.

-kari

 

[h90]

First off, I've been diving for 15 years, and have right at 100 dives. I'm PADI Advanced Open Water Certified and do most of my diving in Hawaii. My wife and I have been coming to the Islands for about 10 years, and we actually got married off the south shore of Kauai on a dive boat three years ago.

So, here's what happened yesterday.

I charter a two tank boat dive yesterday with an operator I picked at random. They had a nice website, and were close to the hotel. They picked me up at the hotel, and made a few other stops to get three other divers. Once we get to the dock, turns out the battery is dead on the boat. The Captain messes with a battery charger for half and hour, and still can't get it started. I noticed the cabin lights were on, and very dim, and suggested that the battery may charge faster if he turned them off. He shuts them down (they had apparently been left on overnight, draining the battery), and after another half hour, the diesel finally turns over, and we head out.

No big deal, things happen.

Next, we really don't have a dive briefing. One dive master asks if I'm okay at 105' and says we're diving on a airplane, and don't touch the eels. Then, both dive masters suit up and jump in. They swim around the boat for a bit locating the mooring line and tie off the boat. Again, no big deal, figured they'd come back aboard to brief and explain the site more. But, they just motion for the four of us to jump in. We do, and start down.

Again, no big deal, good vis and a neat wreck. They did, however fail to mention there was a pretty good current on the way down, and getting there was a workout.

Again, no big deal.

Next site is at 35-45'and they did brief us a bit more on it than they did on the first dive. They also switched out everyone's gear. We go in, and on decent, I check my air, 1300# We were shallow, so I stayed with the group for about 5 minutes. I finally get one of the divemasters attention, and signal I'm low on air, need to surface, and ask which direction the boat is. She doesn't get what I'm asking and hands me her octopus. I decline as I'm still at 900# and 35 feet but let her know I need to do a controlled accent, and find the boat.

We go up together, and the boat is at least 1/4 mile away. Neither of us have a safety sausage, but I have a whistle. Took a about 10 minutes to get the captains attention, but he finally see's us and picks us up.

She asks me what happened,and I tell her I had an empty tank. She assures me she switched it and I say I know, I watched you do it.

Now, I know The majority of fault lies on me. I didn't check the pressure prior to going in. It's my gear, and I'm responsible for it. Nothing bad came of it other than an aborted dive.

What troubles me is one of the divers was on his 5th dive, and is 67 years old. I kinda watched over him a bit on the first dive, and while he did well, I don't think he looked at his reg once. He more or less just did what the rest of us did, and surfaced with us. Had he gotten the empty bottle, it could have ended poorly.

My divemaster apologized half a dozen times, and I told her I wasn't upset. I also let her know it was between her and I, and I wasn't going to mention it to the other divemaster or captain.

I've never had this happen before, but even after 100 dives, I'll never go in without checking the "new" bottle again...

I don't get the problem. 900 psi at 35 feet sounds OK, easily another half hour of diving in the shallow 35 feet.