DIR, WKPP, GUE, and Halcyon Part 1 of 3

[Diver0001]

MHK once bubbled...


Let me see if I can offer some thoughts for consideration, and I suspect JJ will also add his thinking as well. Scuba forums have evolved over the years from their infancy when it was a good way to share diving protocols from one geographic location to <snip>

Hope that helps..

Thanks for your thoughts, Michael.

Here's a thought to finish on. I have a hard time accepting, as you seem to be suggesting, that expertise and belligerence go hand-in-hand or that it can or should be tolerated even if it can be understood.

You are absolutely right, of course, to point out the GI can represent himself and DIR anyway he sees fit. That it has created a PR problem for GUE or that it has turned DIR in some way into something of a 4-letter word is obviously not my problem. I guess a decade of insults has me more incensed than I would like to admit. Time to disappear out of this discussion I would think.

R..

 

[ghof]

Pufferfish,
I was upset with so many areas of the class,the instructors but not the content. Let me explain a little.
I drove 7 hours to get to the dive shop, then we sat around for three hours while MHK and DM memorized our names. Who gives a rip what my name is? PPPPPP!
Saturday, drive to Gilboa from Detroit. At 10 am we are ready to start the class. Testing and fitting equipment, cutiing off my crotch strap, in the drysuit, in temperatures high enough to cause heat stroke to a camel. No replacement for the crotch strap didn't help at all! No way to get trim with the tanks all over the place! PPPPPP!
Andrew, at inspection of my new custom drysuit . To paraphrase a bit and to interpret what he said essentially "buy the one like mine 'cause yours is a POS". Unfortunately he is rightabout mine.
Lastly and perhaps more important is that I was suffering from acute back spasms. Herein lies the attitude. There is no room for less than perfect people in DIR. If you can't do it their way, quit. The fact that the crotch strap was removed all but ensured that I would be a complete failure in the water. Now came the belittlement/snide remarks rather than HELP. Just for kicks release your crotch strap loosen your harness around your waist enough to be able to breathe and move your 104's up toward your head and try to do a back kick or a valve drill or any other drill for that matter. Then have someone remark"have you ever dived before"and "you should quit diving". All this (other than cost)and I would take the class again from another instructor but I would not let them touch my gear! PPPPPP. These instructors had no plan! It was a bad weekend. I truly think that it was the intention of the instructors to create the problems rather than to solve them. To make themselves feel they are superior by intentional belittlement. I won't condone people like that.
PPPPPP!
GHOF

 

[O-ring]

I am curious...why the hell did they remove your crotch strap? It is such an integral part of the setup that I can't imagine it being removed for any reason..

 

[GreenDiverDown]

ghof once bubbled...
Pufferfish,
I was upset with so many areas of the class,the instructors but not the content. Let me explain a little.
...
GHOF

I'm sorry...I don't buy this one. NOTHING about this sounds right!

SA

 

[pufferfish]

ghof once bubbled...
Pufferfish,
I was upset with so many areas of the class,the instructors but not the content. Let me explain a little.

Snipped

Lastly and perhaps more important is that I was suffering from acute back spasms. Herein lies the attitude. There is no room for less than perfect people in DIR. If you can't do it their way, quit. The fact that the crotch strap was removed all but ensured that I would be a complete failure in the water. GHOF

Thanks Ghof. It is nice to hear from someone who has actually taken a GUE course offer their thoughts on the DIR-F. That is too bad about your back problems. Did they offer you the opportunity to take the course again at a reduced rate when you are feeling better and with a crotch strap?

Once again I think this is a big PR problem for GUE that is an issue for them here in Canada as well. GUE needs to realize there is a huge potential market of moderately skilled and 'mouthed' divers out there who by the way don't smoke and who would like to improve their skills, but because of the type of experience you describe and this same 'attitude' displayed by what I suspect is a minority on these dive boards they choose to sit on the sidelines or look at alternative courses to upgrade those skills. I've been diving on and off for twenty some odd years and always know I can learn new skills or improve my old ones. I would just like to do that learning in a healthy environment without the belittlement or feeling one will be assimilated. Maybe JJ can comment on these issues.

 

[O-ring]

pufferfish once bubbled...


Thanks Ghof. It is nice to hear from someone who has actually taken a GUE course offer their thoughts on the DIR-F. That is too bad about your back problems. Did they offer you the opportunity to take the course again at a reduced rate when you are feeling better and with a crotch strap?

Once again I think this is a big PR problem for GUE that is an issue for them here in Canada as well. GUE needs to realize there is a huge potential market of moderate divers out there who by the way don't smoke and who would like to improve their skills, but because of the type of experience you describe and this same 'attitude' displayed by what I suspect is a minority on these dive boards they choose to sit on the sidelines or look at alternative courses to upgrade those skills. I've been diving on and off for twenty some odd years and always know I can learn new skills or improve my old ones. I would just like to do that learning in a healthy environment without the belittlement or feeling one will be assimilated. Maybe JJ can comment on these issues.

There are dozens of trip reports all over the net saying EXACTLY the opposite of what this one does about these SAME instructors. It's kinda like Ebay feedback...a couple hundred positives, one negative...you decide..

As for myself, I will wait and reserve judgment until this poster elaborates more or points me to a trip report or some other classmates before deciding if his claim has merit.

 

[pufferfish]

O-ring once bubbled...

There are dozens of trip reports all over the net saying EXACTLY the opposite of what this one does about these SAME instructors. It's kinda like Ebay feedback...a couple hundred positives, one negative...you decide who is full of the stinky stuff..

As for myself, I will wait and reserve judgment until this poster elaborates more or points me to a trip report or some other classmates before deciding if his claim has merit.

Agreed that this may be just one student who didn't mesh with the instructor or may be the instructor just had a bad day. There are always two sides to the story however this is one person who decided to purchase a service and drive a long distance for that service only to leave with a bad taste in his mouth. It appears he thought the course content was great but that the instructor's teaching methods need to be looked at. Maybe the instructor in question will chime in with their thoughts on the matter.

 

[O-ring]

pufferfish once bubbled...


Agreed that this may be just one student who didn't mesh with the instructor or may be the instructor just had a bad day. There are always two sides to the story however this is one person who decided to purchase a service and drive a long distance for that service only to leave with a bad taste in his mouth. It appears he thought the course content was great but that the instructor's teaching methods need to be looked at. Maybe the instructor in question will chime in with their thoughts on the matter.

I would love to hear more about it...I am dying to know why he did the class without a crotch strap...that seems really bizarre, IMO..

 

[Big-t-2538]

O-ring once bubbled...

I would love to hear more about it...

I too have an interest in hearing more from ghof

 

[diverbrian]

It just seems to me that any course that involves equipment changes, a relatively different philosphy of diving, and other major improvements in one's diving should take more than a weekend.

I went through some of these types of issues when I took my Advanced Nitrox course. It was my first experience in doubles, I had the obvious work on my rig with that being the case.

That course took me close to five months, so that I could complete the equipment upgrades and learn what I needed to learn AND incorporate it into my own diving instead of "cramming for the test."

I understand that GUE doesn't have enough instructors to do it any other way. But, I prefer to learn over time and make what I am learning part of my own style, rather than get it crammed into me so fast that my chances of "failure" go way up.