DIR, WKPP, GUE, and Halcyon Part 1 of 3

[Robert Phillips]

Just curious when did JJ write "The Hogarthian Gear Configuration?"

The article is printed in the first edition of IANTD's Technical Diving Encyclopedia from 1998, but I am not sure if this is the first printing of the article, as it most likely was written before this date.

 

[pufferfish]

Atticus once bubbled...
I suspect that a great deal of the damage that's been done to GUE's PR image has come from GI. I recognize that GI is not formally part of GUE, however there has been the ongoing appearance of a close relationship.

I think a great number of divers have felt insulted directly or indirectly by GI and that that is causing a lot of reluctance to accept GUE as a reputable training organisation.

Perhaps if GUE were to "come out of the cave" and publicly distance themselves from GI it would help.

Yes I think it would help immensely and be good for business.

 

[Scuba]

pufferfish once bubbled...



Just curious when did JJ write "The Hogarthian Gear Configuration?"

Don't know. Earliest reference I found on the web was 1996.

 

[pufferfish]

Scuba once bubbled...


Don't know. Earliest reference I found was 1996.

Funny how those facts seem to 'twist' somewhat from 1996 to 2003 don't they

 

[Whirling Girl]

OK, call me crazy, but I don't see any discrepancies in JJ's discussion of the evolution of the term 'Hogarthian'. It all fits together just fine.

Listening to the clash of egos on this thread has been like watching the Discovery channel, though.

I am looking forward to JJ's continued thoughts. I hope that he hasn't changed his mind after reading all this stuff.

Margaret

 

[Col.Cluster]

Atticus once bubbled... I ...
quote:

Atticus once bubbled...
I suspect that a great deal of the damage that's been done to GUE's PR image has come from GI. I recognize that GI is not formally part of GUE, however there has been the ongoing appearance of a close relationship.

I think a great number of divers have felt insulted directly or indirectly by GI and that that is causing a lot of reluctance to accept GUE as a reputable training organisation.

Perhaps if GUE were to "come out of the cave" and publicly distance themselves from GI it would help.

Pufferfish once bubbled... I ...
Yes I think it would help immensely and be good for business.

Folks

I will take JJ’s and GI’s knowledge and experience and that of the GUE instructors (over all this bellyaching), as my life underwater depends on my ability to think and act correctly and responsively to any and all situations that present themselves during a dive. It was our training by the GUE that made today’s dive a complete success despite the challenges that we encountered, which ranged from vis so bad that at one point I could not see my gauges, even when I held them right up to my mask with my 18 watt HID to a max vis of 3 ft. To a minute or two of lost touch contact with the rest of team. To CFing the first lift bag then deploying a second one successfully. To successfully surfacing to find the pursuit boat waiting to retrieve us. We entered and exited as a team. That training came from the top down. We were a team and we knew what each of us had to do as a team player in order exit the scene safely.

I did approx 900km round trip today for a 22 mins dive that did not make it past 60ft and it was a worthy endeavour. We resolved the problems and exited safely and with purpose as a complete team. It was GI’s hammering at the details; JJ’s GUE Instructors and the GUE training and informative knowledge, which they are more then willing to pass on (if you are willing to look, listen and learn) that enabled us to manage an exorbitant amount of task loading in a minimal amount of time: And we still managed a controlled DIR ascent.

It did not come from you folks that spend far too much time surfing the net then you do diving.

Why not go for a little more diving and a little less typing.

All the best
CC

 

[SimonN]

Click on the link in my sig, it explains everything.

 

[Bloop]

SimonN once bubbled...
Click on the link in my sig, it explains everything.

I think I prefer the other link on your site...

http://www.thedugong.kicks-ass.net/?page=stroke.html

:wacko:

 

[Scuba_Vixen]

certainly not the conditions I'd wish to dive in either. But reading your post, finally crystalized in my mind, what I think is one of the things that foment resentment towards DIR. While I've not seen anyone credible ever say that GUE doesn't produce excellently trained divers/teams...Thosed trained by GUE, seem to radiate a bravado that says that there are no other excellently trained divers/teams because GUE is the only one who can DIR..... And a lot of us just aren't buying it!

From your post, you all had an arduous dive in crap conditions, that's how it goes sometimes, but there's plenty of Non GUE divers/teams doing the same dives, and guess what, they come back all together too. It takes great self confidence, as well as team member confidence to manage these dives, no question about that, but a lot of chest beating and war whooping is just counter productive. There's kind of a "we did it, but no one else is good enough to...and it's all because of George..." attitude in so many of the GUE trained people that the rest of us get the "seen 1 dir guy, ya seen 'em all" feeling. Those that walk softly, speak graciously, and keep getting the job done, are the ones that get the real respect. Unfortunately, that doesn't seem to be GI's style.

Anyway, I'm glad I finally put into words what it is that ruffles my feathers about the DIR thing.

I too tend to feel most alive when I've overcome great challenge...


Darlene

 

[SimonN]

Vixen,

I appreciate your views. I had them too. However, being the curious and open minded sort of chap I am I went along to a Fundamentals class and found all the instructors (Andrew Georgitsis, Martin Lorenzo and Guideon Liew) to be incredibly humble (except AG when talking about his surfing, but he's a saffie so that's to be expected ) and matter of fact.

Very different to most instructors I have met who are more than willing to tell you how great they are at the drop of a hat.

Martin has even dived with John Bennett a lot and while his hand over hand ascent technique left some things to be desired, Martin said that anyone should be in awe of John's training regimen. In other words it was very far from "lets look at the strokes and laugh".

I really would urge anyone to do a fundamentals course, even if you do not believe you ever want to be DIR. Forget about anything you have read about it on the net and go with an open mind as well.

Cheers,

Si.