DIR controversy?

[Thalassamania]

My suits are all black, on a cruise from Iceland up to the ice my black viking was hanging in the locker and one of the wags on the team dubed it, "Darth's waders"

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

We go quietly off in a corner in our black suits (mine's not, actually)

Your drysuit is not only "not black" ... it's also "not dry" ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Cacia]

doesn't she have a pee valve?....or those diaper things? I am so dense, I was on this board for months before I realized that was not a joke.

seriously though, jason. If we shut Thal down, it would be our loss. he has quite a background, and is very humble. Full of great experiences from "back in the day" and a cool, self deprecating humor that can only be appreciated from more than one post.

 

[JeffG]

doesn't she have a pee valve?....or those diaper things? I am so dense, I was on this board for months before I realized that was not a joke.

leaky drysuit.

 

[TSandM]

Catherine, I'm howling.

My suit LEAKS.

I did a 78 minute dive Saturday, and managed to contain myself.

 

[Hank49]

I've dived Cozumel 8 times and never seen a DIR diver. Who did you dive with? I'd love to dive with some. I've never been on a boat in Cozumel with another diver in a BP/w. I'm not GUE-trained, BTW. Sometimes, I even dive in split fins.

The only DIR diver I ever met was on Roatan a couple years ago. He was really nice actually and never said I was a moron for using a short hose and jacket bcd. I'd never heard of DIR until I joined Scubaboard, so I asked him why he had such a long hose. He told me it was good for cave diving..which made perfect sense. Then I saw him in the water and he was a total lizard....no buoancy skills at all. (just kidding) He was good. Hank

 

[Cacia]

Catherine, I'm howling.

My suit LEAKS.

I did a 78 minute dive Saturday, and managed to contain myself.

well, you know how us "old wrecks" get.....

 

[TheRedHead]

well, you know how us "old wrecks" get.....

You're never going to get over that....make poor Jeff feel guilty for the rest of his life...

 

[lamont]

Of more concern to me is that DIR seems to push (at least is represented as advocating) the idea that one gear configuration optimally satisfies all needs. I use different dry suits for different needs (e.g., polluted water, shore entry, arctic diving).

The only real DIR restriction about drysuits is against fleece and against neoprene drysuits because they promote dynamic instability, and in favor of proper fit and range of motion. The "cave cut TLS350" crowd (including GI3) is not representative of GUEs teachings and if that doesn't get the job done for you, then you can use something else.

I use different wetsuits for different temperature regimes.

That's a good idea. I don't know why this is coming up in a criticism of DIR.

I have more than a half dozen pair of fins, each pair for its own purpose. The fin that I’d wear in a turbid, swiftly moving river is very different than that which I’d use over a silty bottom in stagnant water. I use a different fin for a shore entry on a steep beach than I use on a shallowly sloping beach with a wider, but lower surf zone.

I find this one a bit puzzling. I don't wear fins on entry/exit from the surf zone since that seems to promote tripping and cracking your head open -- and that has nothing to do with DIR, that's just how everyone around here dives -- although my PADI class taught entries with fins on.

And if you need to kick so hard that you think you need splitfins it seems like that dive would be better done as a drift dive or using a scooter. The only exception to this kind of thing would be PSD rescue diving in moving water, in which case its mission criticial that you're optimizing for being able to move as fast as possible (and hopefully you're training for cardiovascular fitness, and you know the risks you're getting into).

Honestly I think that DIR has this one right, which is that if you're diving in significant amounts of current and don't have scooters and the diveplan involves kicking as hard as you can and risking overbreathing your regulator and taking a CO2 hit, that you just excersize option #1. Don't mess with the gear config to do a dive which isn't planned out safely.

The same can be said of almost every piece of gear, down to my mouthpiece.

Not sure why you're optimizing for mouthpieces, but the only thing DIR would have to say is not to mess up donation of the long hose, so avoid the custom ones that only fit your mouth...

And I don’t understand the fascination with canister lights. I happen to think that canister lights are great, but only when it’s dark.

Around here its almost always dark. Diving in 100 foot viz in broad daylight across shallow reefs, can lights aren't so useful, so leave 'em on the shore. Its perfectly DIR to do so, just tuck the long hose into your waistbelt so it doesn't flop around. I dove that way for dozens of dives before I bought a can light. Occasionally I do dives where the canlight doesn't help at all, but I leave it in place because I don't want to mess with gear and want to use it for hose routing, but I'm consciously making that choice. Generally its not a big deal.

So, really, I don't see any way that DIR restricts gear config in any of the ways that you mentioned, other than the fin choice. Dive with whatever exposure gear you like/need, just keep in mind fit and dynamic instability. Dive with or without lights. Pick whatever mouthpiece you want provided that you can still donate it. Whats the big deal?

 

[Thalassamania]

And we also have the problem on the other side that the self-appointed anti-dir reps often have no actual understanding of DIR, other than internet rumor, and have no trouble also appearing self-righteous. But that does not keep them from making stuff up

Quite right. I apologize for the oversight. Of course the problem exists on both sides. Thank you the correction and clarification.

Technical divers have been using mostly black gear for a long time (long before GUE existed), so what? This is not any exclusive realm of DIR so I am not sure why you are worried about being misidentified.

I don’t like having my opinions prejudged by both sides. I’m in black with a long hose and an Oceanic Omega 2nd state dangling from my BC inflator, neither fish nor fowl as it were, and being greeted strangely by the partisans of both sides in a fuss that I’m neither part of nor fully yet understand.

Not sure where the urban myth and cultural part fit in.

For example, within the scientific diving community there is a story about someone who, back when neck straps came with single hose regulators, drowned because an OOA diver grabed his primary, pulled on it, lost hold and when the regulator snapped back it broke the diver’s (donor’s) jaw and he drowned. As a result there has been an unspoken (but sometimes codified) rule against neck straps. I think that the story is an urban myth, but it is enough part of the culture of the Scientific Diving Community that, at least us old timers, hear “fingernails on the blackboard,” every time we see a full DIR configuration. There are, I fear, similar things in DIR. It should not be hard for you to see them, but if you don’t it would do me no good to point them out to you.

Wow.

Wow what? This comes as a shock?

Of course not, where did you come up with this one? Many in the DIR crowd, including it's founders, have training from mulitple agencies, including TDI, NSS-CSD, NACD, etc. Go look at the resumes of the instructors on the GUE site. You will see a diverse training background.

I don’t know what makes you think I was discussing the founders, or for that matter, anyone’s training background. I was pointing to the concept that there is only one way to skin a cat, it just ain’t so. There is only one way to skin a cat if you’re on my team … that’s the truth; but we all know that there are other ways that can be equally effective.

Really. Is it your opinion that DIR does not allow for proper exposure protection? That would be just silly. And it is also one more way these incorrect rumors start.

Now you are taking things out of context and getting ridiculous. What I was doing was comparing the idea that only one kind of fin fits all conditions to idea that one kind of exposure suit fits all conditions. Both are absurd statements. I will try to bring my sarcasm up out of the weeds next time.

Again, Wow...
You come on here bashing:
"the DIR system seems to be a pretty good one, in any case vastly better than the dominant form represented by the Tweedledee-Teedledumber act of the RecCom"
Calling the recreational dive community a tweedle-dumb act... then say that you don't like outbursts and how they set a negative tone?
Why don't you share with everyone where you are coming from, and what training you do support. Then the rec divers on here can argue with you and give DIR a break for a few minutes

I don’t really see that as bashing, it’s a basic truism to most of us, regardless of past agency affiliation, who been around a while. The depauperate state of diver training is not something we spend much time arguing about. I for one have no particular interest in arguing with the rec divers or any particular stake in trying to fix their situation. It has no effect on me and I already wasted a great deal of effort on the issue in years gone by.

Right now I’m very interested in what GUE is doing and what DIR is about. It represents a new synthesis of ideas and concepts. Which is not to say that all the ideas and concepts are right, but they'll grow and change with time if they don't get locked up by stubborn pigheadedness and outside attacks.

As for me, I’m going to drag myself kicking and screaming into a necktie auxiliary the next time I’m in the pool and if I like the feel and can work my kata with it … I’ll take it into the ocean. That’s where I’m coming from, that’s the kind of training I support.