Did we find the bottom ?

[PvilleStang]

Crap Frank! I just did some quick math. 1.4atm P.P. O2 is at 187 ft. and 1.6atm P.P. O2 is at 218 ft. You start pushing some limits there and risking Oxygen Toxicity; not to mention the gas supply situation for hitting your deco obligations.

Eh I wouldn't worry about O₂ Tox at 166. 1.4 is an EXTREMELY conservative estimate that PADI and NAUI and others push across as the conservative limit, and 1.6 is the extreme limit. 1.61 won't make you take a hit most likely. It hits everyone differently, and some won't even take the hit until 2.something.

 

[FIXXERVI6]

Crap Frank! I just did some quick math. 1.4atm P.P. O2 is at 187 ft. and 1.6atm P.P. O2 is at 218 ft. You start pushing some limits there and risking Oxygen Toxicity; not to mention the gas supply situation for hitting your deco obligations. Interesting story though. I am glad you guys had fun and I am sorry I couldn't make the trip. I just had too much crap to do around here.

I had to argue with my mom's apartment complex manager. Seems they think her rent wasn't paid for December. I have a cancelled check that says different.
Message to Soudan, Frank would have been diving standard air, 21% O2, Al 80 single tank. 'DiveGuy has a more elaborate set up with doubles. I believe they are both steel 120 cu.ft. 'DiveGuy was probably diving std. air but you can never tell with that guy.

I push my bottom gas to 1.4 every time, 1.6 ond deco, lots of conditions surround ox tox not just PPo2.

1.26 PPo2 at 166, normal healthy people won't tox at 1.26, my concern would be for gas supply/redundant gas with proper reserves.

 

[FIXXERVI6]

I took extra care to follow both our progresses on the 2 dives to ensure a safety net. Deep-dark-chilly and loads of fun!

Just as a foot note....I was wearing my toasty drysuit and using my st. HP130/with H valve a tec air fill......in addition I slung my 50 watt wreck canaster light and a full 19ct. pony bottle as a reserve for us.

I don't want to be the one comming accross the the ***** here but I sure hope this is a joke, everything in here has the stench of a trust me dive for starters.

Question, what is a "tec air fill" ?

I don't see anything in here that indicates extra care to ensure a safety net, if you are stating you would take care of both of you, not only is this a trust me dive, this was not a team dive, if you had a catastrophic failure would the AL80 and the 19Cft got you BOTH back to the surface safely with stops? Did you pad "your computer readouts" to account for temperature and exposure protection? you do know that being cold effects offgassing right?

How exactly would 19 cft pony have done you any good at 166 feet of depth? Did you do the math, is 19 cft enough to get a diver through deco and safely to the surface with proper safety factor? What would have happened in a buddy seperation? Now if you say oh I'm a good enough buddy that won't happen, thats one factor that you didn't count into your "safety net" that can and does happen espeically in low visibility lakes, if the $h1t hits the fan you better be able to take care of the situation yourself when your pulling a dive off in those conditions, the "reserve" being a little pony carried around by your buddy is not a safety net.

Do you consider a single AL80 with a buddy carrying a 19 Cft pony for "reserve" to be a safe practice when diving deep air?

Alan did you ignore your training when you did this dive? I would assume a properly trained "trimix tec diver" would know better than pulling a stunt like this.

Was everyone diving two computers? Was anyone carrying a precut backup deco schedule just in case? Did you actually sit down and calculate gas volumes for the dive? (answer to that is no, or if you planned it to come back at 150 then you might as well play russian roulette on your SIT).

Was there any oxygen anywhere in case of an emergency? If not what would you have done in the event of someone showing symptoms of DCS after the dive? What if you woudl have gotten tangled on the bottom and spent an extra 10 minutes at 166 feet to get free before surfacing, go ahead and run the numbers and see what an additional 10 minutes at 166 on air does to your deco schedule, did you put in proper gas reservers to account for said ermergencies?

Guys "tec" diving is about using the proper tools and procedures to pull a dive off and minimize the risks to dive again another day, anyone can buy an H, a "wreck light" and a pony and hit the water and go to depth, only proper gear and planning will minimize risk.

Now I know what your thinking here is that know it all jerk mouthing off again, if you feel that way so be it but if you drop the ego and really think about what I've put up here maybe you'll think twice before just jumping into a dive like that again, if I didn't care I'd just read the posts sit back and go "idiots" but I've met you guys, I don't want to pick up the paper one day and read about a body recovery.

If you want to dive deep air, go for it, but minimize the risk, proper gear and propper planning guys.

Alan who was your instructor for Trimix? I'm curious if he just didn't teach you or you just ignored the training.

You can ignore me or fire back or whatever, or you can do what I would prefer and why I posted and go wow man I never thought about that, or that, or your right about this, ah, now I realize what I just did, thanks for the post.

Or I can be the TSD ***** I really don't care, but at least I tried, but i post this with no anger, only concern for my fellow diver, dive safe guys, please.

 

[ianr33]

A couple of years ago I was starting to head back up from a dive in Travis when my buddy disappeared.Turned around and found him quickly.He was pointing rather forcefully at his manifold. I checked his valves,they were OK.Offered him a reg,no,not what he wanted.***?
Felt around his manifold. Ah,thats the problem! Turned out he had swum into a steel cable that anchors a no swim bouy. Not too hard to do in 6 inch viz.Unhooked the cable and all was good. Communicating in the crappy viz was not easy and I am sure there was some narcosis involved as well. (we were at about 130)

Do the same thing in a single 80 when low on air and it could turn out very badly.

Personally if I am going deeper than about 100 feet and/or into the trees then I am wearing doubles. However,I am not your mother.

I would also be concerned about wearing a wetsuit in 47 degree water on deco dives. Not going to help offgassing.

 

[ShakaZulu]

Now this is a post that I would not have posted.....sounds reckless to me, no dive planning, no regard for safety, geezuz.

Maybe some more training would be a good x-mas presents for you kids, ignorance is bliss.

 

[texdiveguy]

Rick..... thanks for what I would expect from you....a very brief review of deep air diving......To help some here without getting into the dive details,,,both dives beyond rec. limits were 'bounced'......we were both surprized I admit that the lake dipped to those depths as the maps don't indicate it nor does some discussions with local divers in the area....we have dove near this spot on several occ. before and not beyond the low 120's, it was surprizing to find the bottom decend as such to the riverbed.....we penciled our topo's. I can assure the reader that follow-up dives here will entail some gear and planning alterations---'exploration leads to change'. You can read into or out of our trek briefs on this succesful day of sport diving what you want. You can try to stir the waters as is your style....the fact is Rick that all went well and at no time on these to short dips were we pushing to hard on the box or envelope flap.......all diving comes with risks and 'anything' can happen on 'any' dive.

PS--- in the spirit of the holidays... best wishs to you Rick your wife and 'newest' family addition.

 

[FIXXERVI6]

Rick..... thanks for what I would expect from you....a very brief review of deep air diving......To help some here without getting into the dive details,,,both dives beyond rec. limits were 'bounced'......we were both surprized I admit that the lake dipped to those depths as the maps don't indicate it nor does some discussions with local divers in the area....we have dove near this spot on several occ. before and not beyond the low 120's, it was surprizing to find the bottom decend as such to the riverbed.....we penciled our topo's. I can assure the reader that follow-up dives here will entail some gear and planning alterations---'exploration leads to change'. You can read into or out of our trek briefs on this succesful day of sport diving what you want. You can try to stir the waters as is your style....the fact is Rick that all went well and at no time on these to short dips were we pushing to hard on the box or envelope flap.......all diving comes with risks and 'anything' can happen on 'any' dive.

PS--- in the spirit of the holidays... best wishs to you Rick your wife and 'newest' family addition.

I did not provide a brief review of deep air diving.

Coming back with 150 psi is not pushing it?

Exploration leads to change, several have gone before you to explore and died, we learn from that and from those who have come back, no need to explore pushing safety.

I agree anything can happen on any dive, so you try to cover as many bases as you can.

I'm not trying to stir the waters, just hoping that others will read and think before they jump into such dives, as for "educating" you thats not my goal, you have already received training and hold more cards than myself so I'm sure there is nothing I can teach you.

Happy holidays back at you, the oldest got scuba gear for Xmas, and I have not found a way to get a 6 cft to sit proper on the newest so he'll have to wait.

 

[Soggy]

Worst dive plan...ever. Glad you didn't die.

Happy holidays.

 

[loosebits]

Man, I swore off scubaboard but just when you think you're out... they drag you back in.

Alan, Frank, you both rolled the dice today. Frank, stop diving with Alan; he has some very dangerous ideas about diving that he appparently can't be talked out of. After a stunt like this, he should have his DM card pulled or at least lose his job, not exactly reflecting well on his dive shop by posting things like this here. Very few people here think he makes a good example of any kind of diving.

Alan, everyone is telling you how dangerous you are. Perhaps you should stop rebutting them and actually consider that they might be right.

Well, back to swearing off scubaboard for another couple of months.

 

[gangrel441]

Worst dive plan...ever. Glad you didn't die.

Happy holidays.

At last!!! Soggy and I agree on something!!!