Deep dives with Argonaut Double hose (305ft)

[The Ruttmeister]

So, if I was an interested engineer, with access to a bunch of 3D printers and a Kraken (who has also been wondering about a silencer)... How would I go about getting access to an STL?

Any reason you haven't tried a high strength SLA resin? That shouldn't have any trouble reproducing those holes.
I wouldn't expect it to last very long with salt water and UV, but worth a try.
It would also be interesting to try going to more of a flat can with the holes all on that flat surface (that would also make a metal mesh much easier too).

 

[Luis H]

I have been using PETG for the material. I have also used ABS, but PETG seems like abetter choice.

I have several prototypes that have outlived their value, so I am planning on doing some hammer testing, to check for impact strength. It will not involve precise instrumentation, but I will video it for record keeping.

The general preference (and definitely my preference) it that the "regulator can" is touching my back or at least very closed to it. The breathing is best if the can is touching right against my back (could not get closer to the lungs without surgery ), therefore the exhaust on the flat surface is not a good option.

I design the cans (almost 10 years ago) with the intention to have a nice comfortable rounded disk that touched my back, but without blocking the exhaust.

You will always see all the vintage cans with the exhaust around the perimeter.

About the STL files, I am not sure where this may be going. I need to talk to VDH (@Bryan@Vintage Double Hose). I will keep you in mind. I may send you a PM in a few days.

 

[Wibble]

I wouldn't exactly call left lean right rich "common" practice, at least not in modern configurations with the VAST majority of divers and instructors putting all gases on the left. I am unaware of any agency that advocates for this practice and only aware of agencies that forbid it because it entraps the long hose in backmount, disrupts the prop wash on a DPV, and has not proven to have any safety benefits. @grantctobin are you aware of any?

Lean left, rich right.
Used on every backmount rebreather, could even call it a standard.
Extremely common in non-DIR circles where additional breathing stages are slung both sides for balance.
Lean-left is the default bailout cylinder position (you won’t be doing a no-tox for bailout)

 

[tbone1004]

Lean left, rich right.
Used on every backmount rebreather, could even call it a standard.
Extremely common in non-DIR circles where additional breathing stages are slung both sides for balance.
Lean-left is the default bailout cylinder position (you won’t be doing a no-tox for bailout)

CCR configuration does not apply to decompression/stage bottles which is what we are discussing.
We are not talking about CCR bailout bottles where there are still some dinosaurs out there diving like that though you could argue that @Luis H was diving a right side lean primary bailout, but the discussion was about stage/deco cylinders where in the 90's people used to evenly balance them between both sides. That is not a practice that is currently being taught or advocated for, at least as far as I am aware. BSAC does some really bizarre things that goes against everyone else in the dive industry but I don't think they even still do that because it traps the long hose when you do.

 

[Wibble]

Was thinking more of sidemounting stages. If diving sidemount with two deco stages, you're hardly going to hang both on the left hand side. You will put one left, one right as with your primary cylinders. It would make sense to do lean left, rich right, although it's common to put the MOD onto each regulator too.

When diving CCR if you're playing around and inside wrecks or even caves, it makes sense to sidemount the bailouts to keep them streamlined and in control. As said, the LHS is the emergency bailout side by convention (lean left, rich right), so you'd have one left one right. If you were diving with 3 stages, then two would be bungeed and there's no reason why the third deco stage shouldn't go to the RHS to leave the primary bailout clear.

 

[tbone1004]

Was thinking more of sidemounting stages. If diving sidemount with two deco stages, you're hardly going to hang both on the left hand side. You will put one left, one right as with your primary cylinders. It would make sense to do lean left, rich right, although it's common to put the MOD onto each regulator too.

When diving CCR if you're playing around and inside wrecks or even caves, it makes sense to sidemount the bailouts to keep them streamlined and in control. As said, the LHS is the emergency bailout side by convention (lean left, rich right), so you'd have one left one right. If you were diving with 3 stages, then two would be bungeed and there's no reason why the third deco stage shouldn't go to the RHS to leave the primary bailout clear.

I have never seen a diver with that configuration.

If going into an overhead you will have a minimum of 2 bailout bottles and those are typically done with the "Standard" sidemount configuration of left hose short, right hose long. Deco bottles are in addition to those bottles.
Again I have never actually seen someone dive right rich left lean for deco bottles and I am not aware of any agency that advocates for that configuration but I am aware of plenty that argue against it.

 

[rx7diver]

... Again I have never actually seen someone dive right rich left lean for deco bottles and I am not aware of any agency that advocates for that configuration but I am aware of plenty that argue against it.

This (left lean, right rich for deco gases) is the configuration that was used in my IANTD "Advanced Deep Air" training in the mid-1990's, for diving deep shipwrecks in the Great Lakes. We used Tom Mount's textbook (actually, I think it was titled "Student Workbook" or something like this), and deco gases used during the training were EAN36 and oxygen. The "Workbook" contained printed deep air tables for Air (bottom gas) and EAN36 and oxygen (the pair of deco gases).

Our deco cylinders were OMS/Faber LP45/46's--which explains why I have three, all three purchased new back then.

This (left lean, right rich) is also the configuration that was used in my IANTD "Technical Nitrox" course.

I ceased using this configuration when I switched out my steel deco cylinders for Luxfer Al40's (and began diving both deco cylinders left).

Thinking about it now, Mount's book didn't actually teach a specific configuration, IIRC. Instead, it presented examples of a couple of different configurations. So, the decision to teach left lean right rich must have been made by the instructors for my respective IANTD courses.

rx7diver

 

[Luis H]

And this is why I often prefer to just think “outside the box”… I am just saying…



We did a short tour of Cairo after the two weeks of diving. Part of the tour included a Nile River cruise.
There was a show and the first song performed by the singer was: did it “My Way”.
I told my dive buddy and the group that they were just playing that in my honor.

 

[Wibble]

I have never seen a diver with that configuration.

If going into an overhead you will have a minimum of 2 bailout bottles and those are typically done with the "Standard" sidemount configuration of left hose short, right hose long. Deco bottles are in addition to those bottles.

Again I have never actually seen someone dive right rich left lean for deco bottles and I am not aware of any agency that advocates for that configuration but I am aware of plenty that argue against it.

Interesting. Where I dive from it's quite common. Certainly with rebreathers, carrying stages left AND right is far more common than carrying all stages left.

Why would one carry both stages left when there's none of the longhose malarkey. Even if diving with a longhose (as I used to with a standard OC backmount), I'd put the third cylinder on the RHS as it's more balanced. Given the chance of donating is close to zero and in any case you'd pass the reg from your mouth to them and tidy up once everyone's living.

On a rebreather there is no longhose -- apart from a very small number of proponents of backmounting bailout and using longhoses. For the vast majority of the rebreather diving community, 95%?, the longhose lives on your bailout which lives on the LHS. The same move to donate as it is to bailout (BOV excepted).

 

[tbone1004]

Interesting. Where I dive from it's quite common. Certainly with rebreathers, carrying stages left AND right is far more common than carrying all stages left.

Why would one carry both stages left when there's none of the longhose malarkey. Even if diving with a longhose (as I used to with a standard OC backmount), I'd put the third cylinder on the RHS as it's more balanced. Given the chance of donating is close to zero and in any case you'd pass the reg from your mouth to them and tidy up once everyone's living.

On a rebreather there is no longhose -- apart from a very small number of proponents of backmounting bailout and using longhoses. For the vast majority of the rebreather diving community, 95%?, the longhose lives on your bailout which lives on the LHS. The same move to donate as it is to bailout (BOV excepted).

you specifically called out wreck penetration and cave diving, do you actually dive in those environments? If you are, then you should be diving with 2x bailout cylinders, and most that are doing that with a "standard" backmount CCR are doing that with sidemounted bailout bottles with a "traditional" sidemount hose configuration and then all other bottles are left hand side only. Again, if you're in a BSAC dominated area then it may be different but no one else in the world is advocating that nonsense to my knowledge, similar to no one else advocating for secondary take except for BSAC.

Please find an example of any article written in the last 10 years advocating for left lean right rich because I would truly love to see it, same for any reputable instructor actually teaching it.

As to why wouldn't you split them? Dive with up to 2 "loaded" and any extras stick on a tail leash. You don't need all that stuff cluttering your body so when you don't need them put them in a bouquet between your legs. It is way easier than trying to fit that many on your body.

Also you clearly don't scooter as trying to scooter with low slung stages on both sides is really uncomfortable and incredibly inefficient.