Deep Air Diving - thoughts

[JeffG]

I bow to your superior knowledge and experience.

Twice in a row. There is hope yet.


(i.e. You can't defend the undefendable.)

 

[wedivebc]

There is the true crime of Deep Air. Not so much as diver's using it (as Thalassamania has said 000's of deep air dives have been completed successfully), but that training agencies teach it before trimix. That gives an impression that it is "easier" than helium.

I believe that all technical divers should be taught to use Helium first (and a couple of agencies agree with me) and if the diver chooses to use Air, then at least he is making the decision from a position of knowledge. He/she would then be able to balance the cost/benefit vs risk/reward for themselves.

A "Deep Air" (read non-helium) trained diver cannot do that. They are missing 1/2 of the data to make a reasonable choice.

The agencies have given their stamp of approval on this type of diving. Thats the crime.

OMG, I agree with Jeff. I might have to re-evaluate my position on this.

I suspect we don't agree on our definition of deep air though.

 

[Thalassamania]

...

I believe that all technical divers should be taught to use Helium first (and a couple of agencies agree with me) and if the diver chooses to use Air, then at least he is making the decision from a position of knowledge. He/she would then be able to balance the cost/benefit vs risk/reward for themselves.

A "Deep Air" (read non-helium) trained diver cannot do that. They are missing 1/2 of the data to make a reasonable choice.

The agencies have given their stamp of approval on this type of diving. Thats the crime.

Frankly, if we were starting over, and if diving was not such a "cheap" sport, (I see adverts on SB for training priced under what it costs to have a set of doubles filled with HELIOX) then some form of mix would be routinely used for most dives below 30 to 60 feet. But that's not the way it developed and now it is what it is.

 

[JeffG]

OMG, I agree with Jeff. I might have to re-evaluate my position on this.

I suspect we don't agree on our definition of deep air though.

LOL, and yet you have a rebreather, so your "cost" for soberty would be less than mine.

 

[JeffG]

Frankly, if we were starting over, and if diving was not such a "cheap" sport, (I see adverts on SB for training priced under what it costs to have a set of doubles filled with HELIOX) then some form of mix would be routinely used for most dives below 30 to 60 feet. But that's not the way it developed and now it is what it is.

Reality is what it is. Helium cost in North America is not the same as overseas too. Its easy to sit around and be high and mighty if it doesn't cost much.

With the rising cost of helium the use of rebreathers and deep air advocates may grow.

 

[Thalassamania]

Reality is what it is. Helium cost in North America is not the same as overseas too. Its easy to sit around and be high and mighty if it doesn't cost much.

With the rising cost of helium the use of rebreathers and deep air advocates may grow.

Which is more dangerous? Which has a better track record? No question that rebreathers win the Carrie Nation award, but what about survivability? I'm not suggesting an answer, just wondering out loud.

 

[wedivebc]

LOL, and yet you have a rebreather, so your "cost" for soberty would be less than mine.

Actually I wasn't referring to myself. I usually dive with HE, its dirt cheap. I refer to the training agencies who require deep air dives as prerequisite to trimix. It makes no sense. I do agree in learning the skills before introducing HE but 150+ on air, (during training) is too much.

 

[Bismark]

Good god, deep air people, trimix advocates, RB users, all agreeing?????What the hell? What next?

And only 147 posts to get there too! :-0

 

[wedivebc]

Good god, deep air people, trimix advocates, RB users, all agreeing?????What the hell? What next?

And only 147 posts to get there too! :-0

Well, Rome wasn't built in a day

 

[JeffG]

Which is more dangerous? Which has a better track record? No question that rebreathers win the Carrie Nation award, but what about survivability? I'm not suggesting an answer, just wondering out loud.

I bet that question is on the minds of a whole bunch of tech divers.

I know for myself, my "tech diving" is time bombed. There will be a point where I will pull myself out of tech diving. I'm just not sure when that will be.

So I really have only a few choices.

a) Suck it up and pay the cash.
b) Scale back tech diving.
c) Push my "Air depth" down
d) Go rebreather.

Right now its a combination of a and b due to an injury. c I am not a fan of. d mean a new investment of cash and time. 10-15K (or more) for equipment/training and up to 2 yrs of use before taking the rebreather to depth. I'm turning 44 this yr, if my tech diving stops at 50 going to a rebreather doesn't makes sense....but then again, maybe a rebreather would allow a longer "tech" diving life expectancy.

Like you...just wondering out loud.