Current SCUBA Instruction Techniques

[gcbryan]

"I always thought vintage diving was more about shallower and in many cases no exposure suit diving where the weighting was done for depth, swimming was required to get down to depth, and when a slow controlled ascent wasn't really happening."

Nothing could be further from the truth. So-called "vintage" divers go wherever more technological divers go and a controlled ascent has always been the norm. I think maybe you should read Jacques Yves Cousteau's book, The Silent World. It tells the story of Cousteau's invention of SCUBA and should give you some insight on non-techno diving.

I have all or most of the "Silent World" series. Things have changed a bit though. Did you notice that they were always adopting an animal and that by the end of the story the animal had always unfortunately died? Their method of capturing GPO's (octos) for example was to spray the den with copper sulfate which ends up killing many of the octos. There are many other things that you read about that are quite crude by today's standards but that is how learning and progress works...we progress.

However I'm sure I do have some misunderstanding of vintage diving...which is why I asked the questions. I do find it interesting.

 

[gcbryan]

Well I live in Savannah, and you are welcome to try it here if you get the inclination and want to vacation somewhere beautiful. I stock Land Shark, Eagle Rare (10 year), and whatever else the cat drug in. For the record, having to control your breathing and be weighted properly is not unique to vintage diving, however it is more important in vintage diving. Vintage diving is not exclusive to shallow or warm water diving. I dove to 120 feet in the Bahamas, and I've dove cold water. Many, many other people have as well. A slow controlled ascent ALWAYS happens. Why would I want to be dangerous? I gather that you have received some bad information?

For the record, I am not anti-technology. One of my minors is in educational technology, I drive a Volkswagen, and I love me some computers. I am anti-technology replacing skill though

Yeah, I think we're all for skill.

Yep, I'm sure my info on vintage diving isn't all that accurate.

I'm originally for North Carolina and I consider moving back from time to time...if I do I'm look you up and do some vintage diving!

Part of the problem is that I (and many others I'm sure) associate vintage diving with what we've seen on TV and we all know that vintage or not most of what gets on TV is usually pretty crude diving with people holding on, stepping all over things, etc.

 

[Paladin]

The Silent World was not a series. Not the book I'm speaking of. It was written in 1953 and details Cousteau's development of the Aqualung and the beginnings of the sport of SCUBA diving.

 

[Slonda828]

Yeah, I think we're all for skill.

Yep, I'm sure my info on vintage diving isn't all that accurate.

I'm originally for North Carolina and I consider moving back from time to time...if I do I'm look you up and do some vintage diving!

Part of the problem is that I (and many others I'm sure) associate vintage diving with what we've seen on TV and we all know that vintage or not most of what gets on TV is usually pretty crude diving with people holding on, stepping all over things, etc.

I will not speak for all of vintage diving (who the heck am I afterall), but I will speak for the NAVED, of which I am the 188th member. We demonstrated vintage techniques for some of the most famous people in diving during the International Legends of Diving in the Bahamas. We did not step on the bottom, mess with the reef, or practice anything out of accordance with established safe diving practices. We all made safe ascents, we all made 3 minute safety stops, and we all had an amazing time.

I hope you return to the area soon, so I can get you in a pool and show you that you can hover perfectly neutral without a BC (when in proper exposure protection and properly weighted). There is a place where modern diving and vintage diving mesh, and that place makes highly skilled divers.

Proof of the seemingly impossible feat is located at:

Bahamas ILD - Apr09

Keep in mind, it's not about "my way is better". It's about keeping the history of our wonderful sport alive, so that people know that a doublehose regulator is not a tiny rebreather in 20 years. I am not a chest-beater, and I have (and use) jacket BCs, tech rigs, and all manner of SCUBA stuff. I just think when a diver looks at JYC on TV, he or she ought to know whom that man is.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I'm kind of jumping in late here, and I'm pressed for time now but I want to add a few comments and experiences.
I was PADI trained about 10 years ago but was a freediver before that. I have decided to follow a minimalist route and have kind of carved out a niche for myself in my own world of diving.
I even went as far as to re-invent the old style backpack and I came up with the Modern Freedom Plate (seen in my avatar).

I'll come back to this when I'm not so pressed, I really do want to get in on the thread. Right now I have to run off to a job.

Later...

 

[Walter]

I did the "doff and don" when I certified, and it was challenging, but I don't see any benefit to it.

I do. It shows a student that they can handle problems that arise.

Scuba instruction is not supposed to be a "weeding out" process, but directing the student toward safe diving techniques.

I agree.

IMHO any skill that doesn't prepare a diver for diving is not a critical part of diving.

True. Doff & don does prepare divers for diving. I wouldn't trust a diver who couldn't do it.

I can't see it as a requirement though, simply because it puts up a barrier for too many people.

It's not a barrier. I've never had a student who had more than minor problems with it. The key is knowing how to teach, teaching skills in small steps that prepare students and putting it toward the end of the class. It's an extremely easy skill if taught correctly.

Confidence in the water doesn't necessarily mean specific physical abilities

Of course it does. Lack of specific physical abilities creates doubt in the diver's mind. Doubts about their ability to deal with problems that arise.

(expect maybe a basic ability to swim)

At least two agencies disagree with you and allow non-swimmers to be certified. Crazy, but true.

 

[ktownhero]

I recently did my OW certification in Roatan and all of the things mentioned in the OP were taught. I learned (and had to demonstrate) a variety of emergency ascent techniques in addition to buddy breathing and dive table usage. I also was required to doff and don my full gear both at the surface and at depth.

It just depends on who you have teaching you. I'm glad these things were taught to me as they made me feel much more confident as a new diver.

 

[miketsp]

Having just read the long thread about the female diver death in the Bahamas
http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/accidents-incidents/287884-bahamas-missing-female-diver.html
where the DM was not able to bring up a resisting diver when they were both going down fast at 140', even with a BC, makes me wonder if all this talk about minimalist diving & neutral buoyancy without a BC isn't just a little bit macho style.
What do you do if you're trying to haul up an overweighted victim that insists on emptying their own BC if you haven't got any reserve buoyancy of your own?

 

[Thalassamania]

I can sorta see an emergency ascent without equipment, but can someone tell me the what skill it teaches to free dive down 30 ft to don gear? I can't see any relation to a recreational diving situation and I would suspect that's why it was dropped.

The key is that in performing that exercise a students learns to calmly perform a fine motor skill subsequent to a high intensity strength move that has put them into a feeling of oxygen debt. Being able to accomplish this, when combined with the ability to perform a significant breath hold or one and a half to two minutes virtually assures a new diver of being able to deal with just about anything that might happen.

The reason exercises like the doff and don (and breath holding for that matter) were dropped was that in the rush to get to a 20 hour weekend class there was not enough time to properly train people. In time we reached the point that most instructors could not do either, and them when even many Course Directors can't. So naturally a face-saving ex post facto rationalization was in order ... ta da!

I'll also admit that hearing about this was one of the reasons I didn't try long ago. I can't equalize quickly and free diving to the bottom of a 12 ft pool can cause pain. I'd never be able to make it close to 30 ft. I can scuba dive by going slowly and equalizing frequently.

You can (and need to) fix that problem.

I did the "doff and don" when I certified, and it was challenging, but I don't see any benefit to it.

Scuba instruction is not supposed to be a "weeding out" process, but directing the student toward safe diving techniques. IMHO any skill that doesn't prepare a diver for diving is not a critical part of diving. The old "doff and don" was a legacy from the old Navy courses, where thinning the herd was part of the course objectives.

For some reason, many out there think that if you're not facing adversity you're not being challenged or mastering the necessary skills.

Just my two cents on the "doff and don" discussion.

By the way, I still believe in buddy breathing, students not standing on a platform when they are waiting for skills, knowing how and why behind tables, and students learning to dive safely without following a DM. But some of the old skills are "old" for a reason.

Often the reason has little or nothing to do with reality. I think this is one of those cases.

Okay, I can see it as a confidence builder. I can't see it as a requirement though, simply because it puts up a barrier for too many people. Confidence in the water doesn't necessarily mean specific physical abilities (expect maybe a basic ability to swim).

I think it's important that students understand that OW training is just a starting point. It gets you in the water with some very basic skills that need to be developed and added to both on your own and with instruction. That seems to be the real failing of a lot of programs. How and which skills you develop is a very individual choice. I think that development is the source of confidence.

That's where we part company ... I certify that students are prepared to actually dive, not that they are prepared
to learn to dive some other time in some other course. I do not certify novices, I not certify beginners, I only certify divers that are competent or proficient. I have almost never had a student who did reach the level of competent.

 

[Nemrod]

I will not speak for all of vintage diving (who the heck am I afterall), but I will speak for the NAVED, of which I am the 188th member. We demonstrated vintage techniques for some of the most famous people in diving during the International Legends of Diving in the Bahamas. We did not step on the bottom, mess with the reef, or practice anything out of accordance with established safe diving practices. We all made safe ascents, we all made 3 minute safety stops, and we all had an amazing time.

I hope you return to the area soon, so I can get you in a pool and show you that you can hover perfectly neutral without a BC (when in proper exposure protection and properly weighted). There is a place where modern diving and vintage diving mesh, and that place makes highly skilled divers.

Proof of the seemingly impossible feat is located at:

Bahamas ILD - Apr09

Keep in mind, it's not about "my way is better". It's about keeping the history of our wonderful sport alive, so that people know that a doublehose regulator is not a tiny rebreather in 20 years. I am not a chest-beater, and I have (and use) jacket BCs, tech rigs, and all manner of SCUBA stuff. I just think when a diver looks at JYC on TV, he or she ought to know whom that man is.

I don't step on or touch anything, I dive 3D and as neutral and balanced as anyone and I do it with no BC. The idea that a BC is needed to maintain absolute control is a misnomer and largely is a result of the inability of the bulk of divers to spend the time to actually learn total control of their bodies in the water column. Precision diving and total control is the goal with or without a BC.

Obviously for heavy exposure gear a limit is reached although I have no problem with a 7 mm suit and no BC. YRMV.

N