Countdown to Leviathan...

[PhilEllis]

I agree with you.....without considerable legal assistance, the Leviathan folks will have a difficult time surfing the tide of a pre-existing legal order that allows H to assume all assets of Salvo in restitution. However, almost any person of common sense would have known how to avoid this FROM THE START! Very simple. Start from absolute scratch. Don't use ANYTHING that ANYONE could argue was a relic of Salvo. For their sake, I hope they are able to reach some sort of agreement with H. However, I don't honestly know what would motivate H to succumb to any agreement short of complete injunction.

Otherwise, this is a doomed deal, no matter how much anyone likes another, no matter how good the customer service is, no matter how good the intentions are.

Phil Ellis
Discount Scuba Gear at DiveSports.com - Buy Scuba Diving Equipment & Snorkeling Equipment

I certainly don't know what's going on but I think you left one point out of you analysis. Lawyers...

If JJ can afford lawyers and Cory can't, JJ's team can likely convince a judge of just about anything, whether it's true or not, if there isn't an advocate standing at the other table.

I don't know that's what happening, but I'm pointing out that having faith in the 'rule of law' and understanding how the court system works are two different things...

I have very little faith that the court system in this country is fair and honest. It's far from it...

Just my two cents...

 

[Gombessa]

CB and Phil, both very good points. Halcyon does need to convince the court of the merits, but even presenting a one-sided story, they need to provide a rationale based in law, which I would assume at this point would be factually consistent with what Jablonski has posted to TDS. I'm just saying that without further information, the whole "revenge motive with wholly baseless overreaching" argument is a long stretch. You COULD certainly get there, especially if you inject intentional deception and guile, but it's a fairly long and meandering path, and right now it makes more sense to me to assume the simpler, more straightforward course until we know more.

I do notice that a lot of people on TDS seem swayed by Halcyon's account of the facts. No doubt having a conviction by the court and a successful civil judgment helps, but it's still just one side of the story, and with Barry allegedly skipping town (which also doesn't help) and Joel/Corey keeping a low profile for now (smart of them), I wonder how the tide of public opinion will shift once the other side of the story gets out.

 

[docmartin]

personally, i don't care about the public opinion and if it shifts or not. the public opinion won't have any effect on the outcome of this saga.

 

[mike_s]

I've been following the DecoStop trainwreck, too, but I was pretty I recall JJ saying they found Salvo materials at Leviathan, not Halcyon materials.

Halcyon may consider all of Salvo's (former) assets to be theirs at this point, but that's not an entirely accurate stance, to my mind.

you're right.... that is a trainwreck happening there.


They do say Salvo materials(assets/property) at Leviathan. (thanks for correcting that.) They also say that the court awarded Salvo assests to Halycon. so I think your comment that Halycon might consider all (or certain) former Salvo assets to be theirs at some point based on the court ruling.


Here's the post in question if anyone wants to read it.

from The Deco Stop - Salvo Closes for Business

Greetings,

For the record I want to correct assertions that we are using the court as a tool to squash competition or that we are malicious about innocent customers that might be damaged by the process. Halcyon is perfectly comfortably competing with anyone that establishes a legal business and I truly regret the collateral damage of people that did not understand the risks they were taking. However, in this case, we have been patiently using the legal system to defend ourselves against a series of amazingly unethical/illegal actions. It was not our choice to be victimized and we were not in control as others manipulated a system that understandably gives a criminal every benefit of the doubt.

When the news first broke about Barry Miller I saw many unkind allegations leveled at Halcyon. We stood patiently during an agonizingly slow legal process. When we thought this process was finally coming to a close Barry conspired with others to hide assets from the court’s judgment. The first attempt was to transfer ownership to his wife which the court ruled fraudulent and nullified. Then Barry used the expertise of others to transfer ownership and assets to a complex set of shell companies while using the name Salvo Manufacturing. Recently the court ruled the Salvo Manufacturing transfer was also fraudulent, awarding these assets to Halcyon Manufacturing. Bear in mind that none of these actions have been “new litigation”. The court merely interpleads the “new” entity given recognition of the potential for fraudulent transfer of assets. As part of the investigation the court recently granted Halcyon the authority to inventory the Leviathan business where we found many of the same Salvo assets that have been moved from company to company as a means to hide these assets from the court’s ruling.

Let me simplify this process by asking each of you to consider how it would feel if a “friend” were able to steal a huge amount of money from you and then flagrantly ignore court judgments by visibly moving that money from one place to another. Could you really say that you would just lay down and forgive them? We have no desire to damage Salvo customers or to squash competition. However, I can’t justify ignoring obviously illegal attempts to defraud Halcyon from its rightful restitution. I hope each of you will strive to give us the benefit of the doubt while the last details of this saga are completed.

Best,
Jarrod

J

 

[RJP]

I once shook hands with Barry at a dive show, does that mean they're coming after my assets next? (extreme example, but it makes a point)

Perhaps, but I have no idea what the point is.

 

[openhelix]

Sad to see this going down such as it is. Agreed that is Leviathan is a new company they should have taken nothing from the former salvo business. Non-tangible IP is a grey area but taking any goods was just asking to get hassled by the courts.

 

[Cave Bum]

...however, almost any person of common sense would have known how to avoid this FROM THE START! Very simple. Start from absolute scratch.

In a perfect world, yes, but look at how this actually played out. Corey & Joel were both hired while Barry was away. The other existing employees, Dwayne & Dee, were let go in the interim by Barry’s wife.

So here are these two ‘johnnie-come-lately’s’ who weren’t involved at all with the start of Salvo or the prosecution and when things go south (I’m guessing here) they tried to do the best they could to maintain a source of income in tough economic times using skills they had developed while at Salvo.

The bottom line is I don’t think the option of ‘start fresh’ was on the table at that point. They were (again, I’m guessing) back-peddling trying to stay afloat.

 

[ScubaAndDreams]

Given this scenario, and the fact that Corey has provided nothing but oustanding service and timely turnaround of items in the past...I would guess he would not have been short of people willing to invest in this new company; which would have allowed him to start from scratch.

Hell, at this point I would just to spite the competition.

 

[Rick Inman]

The reason i know about this is because some poor sap (diving friend of mine) is trying to buy a light for the Trimix class he's in. First my LDS (on my insistence) sets up an account with salvo and orders this kid a light. But does it ever get shipped? Nope. Thus the email I posted in the first thread. My LDS owner and the customer friend and my tech instructor friend are not happy. But I insist that if they are just a LITTLE more patient they can be one of the first on our block to get a Leviathan. Finally the LDS sets up the account and places the order, and now here we go again... My buddy the instructor wants the kid to have a light for the class (midway ion right now), the LDS owner wants to sell the kid a light. The kid handed over his money weeks ago and has no light.

And it's all my fault for trying to help, kinda...

The guy buying this light told me yesterday that he talked to Cory on the phone, who told him that he has a pile of stuff ready to ship, and it will (should) ship on next Thursday after the court appearance. Remember, this is he-said he-said he-said information, so take it for what it's worth.

 

[ONESPEED]

The guy buying this light told me yesterday that he talked to Cory on the phone, who told him that he has a pile of stuff ready to ship, and it will (should) ship on next Thursday after the court appearance. Remember, this is he-said he-said he-said information, so take it for what it's worth.

I sincerely hope so, I just finished my tech course that I specifically bought my light for, sucked not having it for the Hydro Atlantic dive yesterday. Of course, the next question is will those of us w/ broken lights have them returned repaired or in the condition that we sent them?