SparticleBrane
Contributor
Is it just me, or does it sound like he's trying to get his instruction on the cheap? 
Continuing Ed. or just paying to dive..
- Thread starter Twiddles
- Start date
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Its just you
Na..it's not.
which generated the concept of the SCUBA Buckuspap:
1 Scuba Buck = $100 US
so when the spouse says, "Just how much did you spend on that SCUBA crap?" you can honestly say, "got a deal, it was just 30 SCUBA Bucks dear!"
No easy answers.
Really.
There are a number of people who have passionate concepts of how diving instruction should work and they are worlds apart.
We have the student who feels instructors should teach for free. I guess we should be required to work at a "real job" in order to facilitate others learning. That or get rid of that disgusting habit of eating. On top of this, he wants just ONE class to learn everything about Scuba.
We do have instructors who agree with him in that instruction should be uber compleat regardless of the length of the class or the cost to the student (both financially as well as emotionally).
Then there are the majority of divers and instructors who fall somewhere in between. We are incredibly flexible in our approach to teaching and being taught and for the most part we are just happy to be in the water, whatever the excuse!
Unfortunately, teaching has long been a loss leader in our industry and many are used to that. I don't blame them for not understanding the value of excellent instruction because the gear side of our industry has subsidized it for YEARS. With the onset of Internet sales, the subsidies have been reduced DRAMATICALLY. So we are undergoing a paradigm shift and we can expect more of this confusion. Traditional shops are having to charge whatever they can just to stay afloat. You simply can't blame them for wanting to make a living and chasing the American dream.
Fortunately, diving is optional. If you find it to be too expensive as a sport, there is always golf (snicker). If you find it to dangerous, then please consider stock car racing. If you find it to be too mentally tasking then you might try building experimental aircraft.
But if you just can't get enough of being weightless and seeing the world in a way that most will never get to experience, then you will work through this conundrum as well as many, many more. Our sport, she is a changing. We either embrace the paradigm shift or relegate ourselves to watching it change from the sidelines. You can be a part of the solution or not: your choice.
Really.
There are a number of people who have passionate concepts of how diving instruction should work and they are worlds apart.
We have the student who feels instructors should teach for free. I guess we should be required to work at a "real job" in order to facilitate others learning. That or get rid of that disgusting habit of eating. On top of this, he wants just ONE class to learn everything about Scuba.
We do have instructors who agree with him in that instruction should be uber compleat regardless of the length of the class or the cost to the student (both financially as well as emotionally).
Then there are the majority of divers and instructors who fall somewhere in between. We are incredibly flexible in our approach to teaching and being taught and for the most part we are just happy to be in the water, whatever the excuse!
Unfortunately, teaching has long been a loss leader in our industry and many are used to that. I don't blame them for not understanding the value of excellent instruction because the gear side of our industry has subsidized it for YEARS. With the onset of Internet sales, the subsidies have been reduced DRAMATICALLY. So we are undergoing a paradigm shift and we can expect more of this confusion. Traditional shops are having to charge whatever they can just to stay afloat. You simply can't blame them for wanting to make a living and chasing the American dream.
Fortunately, diving is optional. If you find it to be too expensive as a sport, there is always golf (snicker). If you find it to dangerous, then please consider stock car racing. If you find it to be too mentally tasking then you might try building experimental aircraft.
But if you just can't get enough of being weightless and seeing the world in a way that most will never get to experience, then you will work through this conundrum as well as many, many more. Our sport, she is a changing. We either embrace the paradigm shift or relegate ourselves to watching it change from the sidelines. You can be a part of the solution or not: your choice.
I'm going to have to try the suba buck thing. My wife calls it scuba crap as well.
I've been fortunate with the instructors I've had. I ask a lot of questions and am willing to listen. I've found that my attitude can detemine to an extent the experience I have.
I've been fortunate with the instructors I've had. I ask a lot of questions and am willing to listen. I've found that my attitude can detemine to an extent the experience I have.
fisherdvm
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Most professional I know charges $100 to $200 per hour. Geez, my wife pays her hair stylist enough, I am thinking about going to beauty school.... But I think you have to be a little effeminate to attract clients...
I think diving professionals are charging too little. Unfortunately, the market might be producing more instructors than we need?? Thus the price is too low... Folks who complains about paying too much needs to reflect upon this...
I think diving professionals are charging too little. Unfortunately, the market might be producing more instructors than we need?? Thus the price is too low... Folks who complains about paying too much needs to reflect upon this...
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There's an old saying, something about, "you get what you pay for, if I recall correctly.fisherdvm:
OP
Twiddles
Contributor
:no I Have never said Instructors should work for free. I have never even implied it. What I have said and what most of you here have confirmed, is that you grossly over-value your worth ($100 per hour??). I charge $68 and I dare say I am considered a professional (hmm charge less, make more how does that work).
I have never said I want to learn everything in one class, I have said that OW and AOW and the three specialties I listed have a high necessity to a beginning diver (many of you have agreed). I have also stated that your purpose in dividing up these classes is based more on your pockets then on our ability as students to learn. I have also stated that it would be less expensive for BOTH the instructor and the student if the classes (mentioned above) were merged. However, it would be less profitable for the instructor.
I have not twisted the facts to suit me, I have paid for my lessons and paid well. I am here because of all the information that is available on this board and how that information can help me. I am also here to tell YOU the instructor how some of your students feel about how you teach. I dont doubt your value, I dont question that you know much more than I do about diving. I do question your elitist stances, your hand-out approach to instruction and your dismissive and derisive attitudes. I question that some of you place your pocket before your student in a way that endangers your student.
You claim this isn't so and you point to your pet agencies to confirm the truth. I point to the numbers of divers who stop diving as proof that your doing something wrong. I believe that more people would be diving today, better trained, better buddies and having much more fun doing what we do if they were properly trained. I suggest that possibly you should focus more on building a safe basic trained diver and you will produce thousands more students to "feed your families". A comfortable diver is thinking about how much fun it would be to try X,Y, and Z specialties and is worried less about his basic fundamentals.
Your not a golf pro, sorry scuba is not there yet and by the way most golf pros make far less than $100 per hour lol. Oh and clubs and bag far less than the startup cost for scuba, oh and further if they slice the ball it doesnt put them at risk of dying. If your going to compare yourself to another "sport" try making one that is at least a reasonable facsimile. Say rock-climbing or ski-diving or some other extreme sport where failure could easily result in death.
Finally a lesson in commerce since most of you appear to be a bit short on the subject. The market determines your value and if you choose to ignore its price invariably you will go out of business. The market only determines your value because you the instructor have allowed the agencies to continually deplete the value of what you teach. You are not indispensible, elitist, or frankly even financialy viable. You are an accessory to an LDS, Resort, Dive Boat, etc. Your agencies can continue to divide your training to the point that 10 years from now OW will be 1 dive on one day of one weekend to make a basic diver. At that point all of you will still be saying you have done your job and the rest is available for a price. You are hurting the "sport" of diving, you are alienating more and more students (evident by padi bashing threads, and all the people who have been saying just dive and you will get trained).
I wish you all the best in your dreams of making a living doing what you love (its a wonderful goal). I just question the kind of dream that puts me and my family at risk.
I have never said I want to learn everything in one class, I have said that OW and AOW and the three specialties I listed have a high necessity to a beginning diver (many of you have agreed). I have also stated that your purpose in dividing up these classes is based more on your pockets then on our ability as students to learn. I have also stated that it would be less expensive for BOTH the instructor and the student if the classes (mentioned above) were merged. However, it would be less profitable for the instructor.
I have not twisted the facts to suit me, I have paid for my lessons and paid well. I am here because of all the information that is available on this board and how that information can help me. I am also here to tell YOU the instructor how some of your students feel about how you teach. I dont doubt your value, I dont question that you know much more than I do about diving. I do question your elitist stances, your hand-out approach to instruction and your dismissive and derisive attitudes. I question that some of you place your pocket before your student in a way that endangers your student.
You claim this isn't so and you point to your pet agencies to confirm the truth. I point to the numbers of divers who stop diving as proof that your doing something wrong. I believe that more people would be diving today, better trained, better buddies and having much more fun doing what we do if they were properly trained. I suggest that possibly you should focus more on building a safe basic trained diver and you will produce thousands more students to "feed your families". A comfortable diver is thinking about how much fun it would be to try X,Y, and Z specialties and is worried less about his basic fundamentals.
Your not a golf pro, sorry scuba is not there yet and by the way most golf pros make far less than $100 per hour lol. Oh and clubs and bag far less than the startup cost for scuba, oh and further if they slice the ball it doesnt put them at risk of dying. If your going to compare yourself to another "sport" try making one that is at least a reasonable facsimile. Say rock-climbing or ski-diving or some other extreme sport where failure could easily result in death.
Finally a lesson in commerce since most of you appear to be a bit short on the subject. The market determines your value and if you choose to ignore its price invariably you will go out of business. The market only determines your value because you the instructor have allowed the agencies to continually deplete the value of what you teach. You are not indispensible, elitist, or frankly even financialy viable. You are an accessory to an LDS, Resort, Dive Boat, etc. Your agencies can continue to divide your training to the point that 10 years from now OW will be 1 dive on one day of one weekend to make a basic diver. At that point all of you will still be saying you have done your job and the rest is available for a price. You are hurting the "sport" of diving, you are alienating more and more students (evident by padi bashing threads, and all the people who have been saying just dive and you will get trained).
I wish you all the best in your dreams of making a living doing what you love (its a wonderful goal). I just question the kind of dream that puts me and my family at risk.
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