etype
Guest
haha...ok, and when you all get drysuits you might as well come up and check out the diving too...you can do charters/hotels and so on for 65% the price ... and then maybe when we come south you give us a discount.
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I dive in mud holes (we call them quary's) where the water temp can be anything from "cut a hole in it" to mid 70's. (Reason: my wife won't let me move someplace warm yet).
Diving in a semi dry 7mm farmer john and jacket isn't all that much of a problem. However, I am buying a dry suit and it has very little to do with time in the water. It has to do with time out of the water. In the spring and fall you can get fairly cold or hot in a 7mm wet suit when you aren't in the water.
Last fall we did some late year dives, and everything was fine until I had to get out of the wet suit. The changing area wasn't heated, and the wind blowing dropped it a tad bit more. The guys in the dry suits didn't have any problems with it.
Also, on a few deep dives in the mid 40's F, the wet suit did get to be a bit cold. I'm pretty tolerant of cold, but I can see lots of people not being able to do it. I know my wife and daughter can't. Their tolerance is about 55 F in the same make of wet suit.
The main advantage a dry suit gives you is the ability to alter the insulation properties of the suit to match the dive conditions with relative ease, just by adding more or less clothing. Wet suits don't have that advantage.
The disadvantage is the old sailors addage if you get your hands wet you will need to pee soon. Of course there are always dry gloves.
I personally will probably use the dry suit for cold weather and water, and switch to a 3-4-5 for warm water days, and hang onto the 7mm as a backup for when the drysuit has to go in to get fixed, which seems to happen eventually.
But back to the orginal question, depending on your tolerance for cold, you could very well dive in a 7mm. I do suggest getting one that is semi dry. You might try renting one from your LDS and see if you feel comfortable at depth with it. If you don't that will save you a lot of money up front.
Also, one other suggestion, unless you "fit" the average mold that they use for wet suits (I don't) you might want to consider a custom suit. My LDS charges an extra $100 for it, but its worth every penny.
Diving in a semi dry 7mm farmer john and jacket isn't all that much of a problem. However, I am buying a dry suit and it has very little to do with time in the water. It has to do with time out of the water. In the spring and fall you can get fairly cold or hot in a 7mm wet suit when you aren't in the water.
Last fall we did some late year dives, and everything was fine until I had to get out of the wet suit. The changing area wasn't heated, and the wind blowing dropped it a tad bit more. The guys in the dry suits didn't have any problems with it.
Also, on a few deep dives in the mid 40's F, the wet suit did get to be a bit cold. I'm pretty tolerant of cold, but I can see lots of people not being able to do it. I know my wife and daughter can't. Their tolerance is about 55 F in the same make of wet suit.
The main advantage a dry suit gives you is the ability to alter the insulation properties of the suit to match the dive conditions with relative ease, just by adding more or less clothing. Wet suits don't have that advantage.
The disadvantage is the old sailors addage if you get your hands wet you will need to pee soon. Of course there are always dry gloves.
I personally will probably use the dry suit for cold weather and water, and switch to a 3-4-5 for warm water days, and hang onto the 7mm as a backup for when the drysuit has to go in to get fixed, which seems to happen eventually.
But back to the orginal question, depending on your tolerance for cold, you could very well dive in a 7mm. I do suggest getting one that is semi dry. You might try renting one from your LDS and see if you feel comfortable at depth with it. If you don't that will save you a lot of money up front.
Also, one other suggestion, unless you "fit" the average mold that they use for wet suits (I don't) you might want to consider a custom suit. My LDS charges an extra $100 for it, but its worth every penny.
etype
Guest
RPanick:
good points...especially having a wetsuit (& drysuit) custom fitted if your going into cold water. My wetsuit is really tight, i found that to help, the water here is cold much of the year except for central Georgia Strait and south. But another thing, especially in a wet suit (& drysuit), is i wear a full set of polypropylene undies. In fact i wear polypropylene undies anytime i'm on the water. In fact i would like to wear them all the time, they are the only synthetic fiber that is more comfortable than natural fibers. It's amazing how comfortable they are...superb, a pleasure to wear, i would say more comfortable than fine cotton or wool. But they are expensive as sin, probably close to silk. And i have many sets and they are like $75 a set.
Anyway, for anyone not familiar with polypropylene (or however it's spelled) if you are looking for an awesome addition to your wetsuit for colder days...check this fabric of underwear out. It's sold in marine supply stores or serious sports stores. Helley Hansen (if you know this famous brand of marine wet wear) makes the sets i wear.
check this link out...this stuff makes a world of difference to the wetsuit (or drysuit) diver
<http://www.thermalunderwear.info/>
in fact this may be the secret to cold water diving in a wetsuit...under as well as over the surface
Anyway, this is the synthetic stuff that holds air, and wicks moisture away from the skin. And does this stuff work as advertised! As soon as you get out of the water this fabric starts drying. As soon you peel off a layer, two or three minutes later 75% of exposed fabric is dry... another minute later your entirely dry. And the insulation properties of the fabric is remarkable. Polypropylene is about the only miracule synthetic fabric that really really impressed me...so much so that i consider it essential part of my gear for any serious outdoor activity. Another amazing thing is how comfortable this stuff is to wear! I would wear it every day, except with the price and the amount of it i need i need to economize. ( i have 8 pair....so i've spend over $600 on underwear...but understand i work outdoors on the ocean).
But anyway, with your quarry diving, or any outdoor activity such as skiing, kayaking, serious hiking...get a pair of these. You'll be impressed by not only the insulation and drying capacity of this fabric...but the almost unequalled pleasant feeling of the fabric against your skin. It's amazingly comfortable.
good points...especially having a wetsuit (& drysuit) custom fitted if your going into cold water. My wetsuit is really tight, i found that to help, the water here is cold much of the year except for central Georgia Strait and south. But another thing, especially in a wet suit (& drysuit), is i wear a full set of polypropylene undies. In fact i wear polypropylene undies anytime i'm on the water. In fact i would like to wear them all the time, they are the only synthetic fiber that is more comfortable than natural fibers. It's amazing how comfortable they are...superb, a pleasure to wear, i would say more comfortable than fine cotton or wool. But they are expensive as sin, probably close to silk. And i have many sets and they are like $75 a set.
Anyway, for anyone not familiar with polypropylene (or however it's spelled) if you are looking for an awesome addition to your wetsuit for colder days...check this fabric of underwear out. It's sold in marine supply stores or serious sports stores. Helley Hansen (if you know this famous brand of marine wet wear) makes the sets i wear.
check this link out...this stuff makes a world of difference to the wetsuit (or drysuit) diver
<http://www.thermalunderwear.info/>
in fact this may be the secret to cold water diving in a wetsuit...under as well as over the surface
Anyway, this is the synthetic stuff that holds air, and wicks moisture away from the skin. And does this stuff work as advertised! As soon as you get out of the water this fabric starts drying. As soon you peel off a layer, two or three minutes later 75% of exposed fabric is dry... another minute later your entirely dry. And the insulation properties of the fabric is remarkable. Polypropylene is about the only miracule synthetic fabric that really really impressed me...so much so that i consider it essential part of my gear for any serious outdoor activity. Another amazing thing is how comfortable this stuff is to wear! I would wear it every day, except with the price and the amount of it i need i need to economize. ( i have 8 pair....so i've spend over $600 on underwear...but understand i work outdoors on the ocean).
But anyway, with your quarry diving, or any outdoor activity such as skiing, kayaking, serious hiking...get a pair of these. You'll be impressed by not only the insulation and drying capacity of this fabric...but the almost unequalled pleasant feeling of the fabric against your skin. It's amazingly comfortable.
I live in the Puget Sound area and started out with a wet suit and even though after the initial shock it's warmer than you think I was always cold.
Some people aren't. I was. I'm a tall, skinny guy and I put up with the hassles of a dry suit because it keeps me warm.
Some shorter, more muscular people seem to be OK with farmer john thick wet suits. You probably need to rent both types and see what works for you.
Some people aren't. I was. I'm a tall, skinny guy and I put up with the hassles of a dry suit because it keeps me warm.
Some shorter, more muscular people seem to be OK with farmer john thick wet suits. You probably need to rent both types and see what works for you.
nitroxbabe
Guest
Did it occur to anyone here that the word "pussy" might be considered offensive???? Sheesh. Spare me the macho-man diving team.
I've dove cold wet, I now dive cold dry, and won't waste my time any other way. You don't like it, don't look at it.
BTW the thin crushed neoprene suits have all the advantages with none of the clumsiness.
I've dove cold wet, I now dive cold dry, and won't waste my time any other way. You don't like it, don't look at it.
BTW the thin crushed neoprene suits have all the advantages with none of the clumsiness.
nyresq
Contributor
I'm a pussy, I dive dry in 70 degree water...
Diving wet sucks, but a trick I learned in my original OW course was to bring a thermos filled with hot water with you to the dive site. just before you go in, pull the neck of your wet suitout a little and pour the hot water down the front of your suit. This prevents the initial shock of cold water flooding your suit when you first jump in. if you jump in with a dry suit, all that water that fills in the suit when you first jump in must be heated by your body before the suit can maintain any insulation value. so why start your dive making your body loose heat before your two feet down.
works even better after your first dive when you pull the wet suit back on.
for those of you that don't have a thermos or need more water to fill your suits, bring a 1 gallon jug (milk jugs work best cause they're thin walled). when you arrive at the site, by car or boat, fill the bottle with water and place ontop of the engine while you dress and gear up. the bottle won't melt as the water acts as a heat sink and in a few minutes you'll have a bottle of warm water. Just don't place on exaust manifold.... on top of valve covers is good location...
Diving wet sucks, but a trick I learned in my original OW course was to bring a thermos filled with hot water with you to the dive site. just before you go in, pull the neck of your wet suitout a little and pour the hot water down the front of your suit. This prevents the initial shock of cold water flooding your suit when you first jump in. if you jump in with a dry suit, all that water that fills in the suit when you first jump in must be heated by your body before the suit can maintain any insulation value. so why start your dive making your body loose heat before your two feet down.
works even better after your first dive when you pull the wet suit back on.
for those of you that don't have a thermos or need more water to fill your suits, bring a 1 gallon jug (milk jugs work best cause they're thin walled). when you arrive at the site, by car or boat, fill the bottle with water and place ontop of the engine while you dress and gear up. the bottle won't melt as the water acts as a heat sink and in a few minutes you'll have a bottle of warm water. Just don't place on exaust manifold.... on top of valve covers is good location...
etype
Guest
apologies to all youthful felines and easily offended kittys...meow.
You don't have to be a macho man to use the word 'pussy'. Lots of sissys use the word...and for that matter, isn't 'macho' supposed to be derogative? I find it is...a long with the double standards of the so-easily offended. Wouldn't it be better if the whole world was so terribly afraid of being offended or offending that it was just one hot pink slab of white toast from coast to coast? All safe, and room temp....ahhhhh.
The remarks were made to people who insist one cannot dive 45F-50F water without a drysuit. Someone else remarked i was implying they were pussies. I said no, but then thought 'hey, i feel the force here...'. I said if you are uncomfortable with that cold in a wetsuit, go dry. But what i was trying to say is it is perfectly doable for a healthy person to dive a wetsuit in that temp water. Actually, it used to be normal. It's a matter of choice...and choice goes both ways.
Look, all kinds of people here...women, men, people in their 40's dive wetsuits in the winter. My girlfriend regularly goes for a swim naked in the ocean in December-febuary ...when it's snowing! when ever she feels like it...(which means i have to also because it puts me in the no-win bind of having to either be macho or a pussy...sigh) And she's from tropical Columbia! It can be cold....but it's endurable and it's part of the satisfaction. And for the price of a decent drysuit you can buy return tickets to Mexico and then dive wet.
Myself, i have more than one type of drysuit...but it's not so much cold or warm...it's just that i love saltwater, obsessively, and i like the streamlining so i can swim freely with next to no weight, and i use less air. If i could, i'd have pumped ocean saltwater for my bath and shower. I've spent a lot of my life living on boats on the ocean. I wear a drysuit almost daily because of enviromental reasons such as contamination, pollution issues and specifically it's a working requirement.
Again, i am not saying there is anything wrong with using a drysuit. Nor did i mean to insult anyone using a drysuit. What i am saying is a normal healthy person can condition themselves easily to dive recreationally in a wetsuit in 45-50F and <B>enjoy</B> it! And i don't say that just as opinion. I say that because i see so many people doing just that...including myself...by choice....and loving it.
Now, if you can understand what i'm saying....what else is there to say?
You don't have to be a macho man to use the word 'pussy'. Lots of sissys use the word
...and for that matter, isn't 'macho' supposed to be derogative? I find it is...a long with the double standards of the so-easily offended. Wouldn't it be better if the whole world was so terribly afraid of being offended or offending that it was just one hot pink slab of white toast from coast to coast? All safe, and room temp....ahhhhh.The remarks were made to people who insist one cannot dive 45F-50F water without a drysuit. Someone else remarked i was implying they were pussies. I said no, but then thought 'hey, i feel the force here...'. I said if you are uncomfortable with that cold in a wetsuit, go dry. But what i was trying to say is it is perfectly doable for a healthy person to dive a wetsuit in that temp water. Actually, it used to be normal. It's a matter of choice...and choice goes both ways.
Look, all kinds of people here...women, men, people in their 40's dive wetsuits in the winter. My girlfriend regularly goes for a swim naked in the ocean in December-febuary ...when it's snowing! when ever she feels like it...(which means i have to also because it puts me in the no-win bind of having to either be macho or a pussy...sigh) And she's from tropical Columbia! It can be cold....but it's endurable and it's part of the satisfaction. And for the price of a decent drysuit you can buy return tickets to Mexico and then dive wet.
Myself, i have more than one type of drysuit...but it's not so much cold or warm...it's just that i love saltwater, obsessively, and i like the streamlining so i can swim freely with next to no weight, and i use less air. If i could, i'd have pumped ocean saltwater for my bath and shower. I've spent a lot of my life living on boats on the ocean. I wear a drysuit almost daily because of enviromental reasons such as contamination, pollution issues and specifically it's a working requirement.
Again, i am not saying there is anything wrong with using a drysuit. Nor did i mean to insult anyone using a drysuit. What i am saying is a normal healthy person can condition themselves easily to dive recreationally in a wetsuit in 45-50F and <B>enjoy</B> it! And i don't say that just as opinion. I say that because i see so many people doing just that...including myself...by choice....and loving it.
Now, if you can understand what i'm saying....what else is there to say?
zeN||
Guest
"Nothing on this board gets me mad, as I take nothing personal from here.
If the majority of people looked at it this way then we would all be better off.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So very true...." Nitroxbabe
zeN||
If the majority of people looked at it this way then we would all be better off.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So very true...." Nitroxbabe
zeN||
nitroxbabe
Guest
Definition "Pussy": [n] informal terms
[n] obscene terms for female genitals
[adj] having undergone infection; "festering sores"; "an infected wound"
Synonyms: ****, festering, infected, kitty, kitty-cat, purulent, puss, puss, pussycat, putrid, septic, slit, snatch, ****
See Also: domestic cat, Felis catus, Felis domesticus, female genital organ, female genitalia, female genitals, house cat
Definition "Macho": [adj] used of men; markedly masculine in appearance or manner
Synonyms: butch, masculine
Definitions provided by www.hyperdictionary.com.
Zen - did I say that? Aren't you industrious, to go look up old comments of mine! How long did it take you to find that?
Do I seem that pissed off? A little irritated, sure. Thanks for the concern, though.
[n] obscene terms for female genitals
[adj] having undergone infection; "festering sores"; "an infected wound"
Synonyms: ****, festering, infected, kitty, kitty-cat, purulent, puss, puss, pussycat, putrid, septic, slit, snatch, ****
See Also: domestic cat, Felis catus, Felis domesticus, female genital organ, female genitalia, female genitals, house cat
Definition "Macho": [adj] used of men; markedly masculine in appearance or manner
Synonyms: butch, masculine
Definitions provided by www.hyperdictionary.com.
Zen - did I say that? Aren't you industrious, to go look up old comments of mine! How long did it take you to find that?
Do I seem that pissed off? A little irritated, sure. Thanks for the concern, though.
Colton,
It sounds like a dry suit that fits like a wet suit and is 6.5mm neoprene or thicker would be a winner. The problem is your budget price. One thing to consider when buying dive equipment is the long term performance and possable resale value. I evaluate the comfort, performance, long term use, and resale into my buying decision.
It sounds like a dry suit that fits like a wet suit and is 6.5mm neoprene or thicker would be a winner. The problem is your budget price. One thing to consider when buying dive equipment is the long term performance and possable resale value. I evaluate the comfort, performance, long term use, and resale into my buying decision.
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