DIR- Generic Cold water dive gear recommendation

[splitti]

I 'll investigatge a bit more also the sylicon vs neoprene seals which I was not aware at all.

There's also Latex, but honestly: The ability to repair a broken seal at the dive site is a game changer. I know a bunch of people who changed to a ring system (and thus, silicone) and haven't looked back. I used to have a Latex seal which was great until it ripped. Then I had to either stop teaching for three weeks or rent a drysuit. Not great.

Although I cannot imagine using the p-valve for the 5-6 years for the dives I plan to do, indeed I 'll include it, for the iota possibility that I may start performing some serious dives in the future lasting for double digit hours.

Cold water increases the vasoconstriction and thus the centralization of blood, which in turn increases the diurese during diving in cold water. Or in other words: You'll find that in cold water you're likely to urgently seek relief after ~45-60 minutes. And unlike a wetsuit, you don't readily find this relief without a pee valve

 

[BlueTrin]

I found this on halcyon website, seems to be their official Norway dealer.

 

[Rich1280]

Pee valves are really helpful on a drysuit in very cold or very warm weather, regardless of dive length. In winter you'll likely gear up and keep your drysuit on to keep warm, and want to drink warm drinks. In this instance, a pee valve really helps. In hot weather you'll just appreciate the ability to keep drinking cold drinks right until you jump in. It just helps thermo regulation a lot better.

Rich

 

[mariosx]

There's also Latex, but honestly: The ability to repair a broken seal at the dive site is a game changer. I know a bunch of people who changed to a ring system (and thus, silicone) and haven't looked back. I used to have a Latex seal which was great until it ripped. Then I had to either stop teaching for three weeks or rent a drysuit. Not great.

Your point seems very convincing. Thanks.

Cold water increases the vasoconstriction and thus the centralization of blood, which in turn increases the diurese during diving in cold water. Or in other words: You'll find that in cold water you're likely to urgently seek relief after ~45-60 minutes. And unlike a wetsuit, you don't readily find this relief without a pee valve

So, when it comes to going to the restroom my metabolism stops for hours, or even days if I am not home. I was hoping to avoid using the p-valve in every dive given the extra preparation process. But I am no aware of this biological effect, thus at least on my first cold dives I will use it just in case.

I found this on halcyon website, seems to be their official Norway dealer.

View attachment 697869

Thanks. I have also found that place, but it's in Oslo, 6 hours away by car from the town I will be living. Also, I don't expect to have a car given the high expenses and taxes.
Excluding the canister light that I will order from Norway, the only thing I need from Halcyon is the wing that I will pick it up directly from Halcyon in Florida.

I hope they can service my lights there though.

Pee valves are really helpful on a drysuit in very cold or very warm weather, regardless of dive length. In winter you'll likely gear up and keep your drysuit on to keep warm, and want to drink warm drinks. In this instance, a pee valve really helps. In hot weather you'll just appreciate the ability to keep drinking cold drinks right until you jump in. It just helps thermo regulation a lot better.

Rich

Thanks for the comment. I will check it in the first dives and explore also myself the tradeoffs.

 

[Buritaani]

Plenty of good advice already here, but chiming in nevertheless (from Finland, next door). A preliminary welcome to the world of cold water diving!

First, forget the wetsuit. A lot of people say they'll use a 7 mil for summer stuff, but almost none actually do after getting a drysuit.

Tanks: Double 12L 232bar steel with concave bottom is very popular and easy to manage, but the non-concave option is good as well. Steer away from 200bar steel bottles.

Wing: 40lbs donut is great for D12 + one stage. The 60lbs wing is needed with double 18L tanks or if hauling lots of stages and other stuff, but is unwieldy with D12.

Regs: You deffo want environmentally sealed regs. Nothing fun in freeflows which won't go away. Apeks is a safe bet, and you can easily use 20+ year old second-hand regs if they've been serviced - or go for the newer ones with better hose routing.

Suit: There are a lot of good options, but if you are looking for a suit to use first in Europe for 2 years and then in the US, I'd go with Santi due to the service support on both sides of the pond.

Seals: Exchangable silicone seals are the way to go. Santi has a brilliant smart seals system for the gloves (it's odd how good it is despite being completely flexible) and you can have a neck ring as well fitted to the suit, definately worth it.

Undersuit: A merino wool base layer is great. With drysuits, you can layer up in winter and switch to a lighter undersuit in the summer. A lot of people swear by the Santi bz400 undergarments, but Weezle makes very warm ones as well, and there are other brands as well. Hestra liner gloves are great. Get ready to use double wooly socks in your booties.

Heating and P-valve: Contrary to some of the other comments here, I'd not rush with these. Learn to dive the drysuit first, then worry about these - they are easy to add on afterwards. Or if you get a good deal on a built-in P-valve, take it, but don't worry about using it until you feel the need for it. I use my valve on perhaps 1/3 of my dives, moreso in the summer when hydration is trickier. Heating for 1/3 dives, moreso in the winter.

Weighting: Drysuit weighting is indeed different from wetsuit weighting. I'd suggest getting a drysuit primer from someone and getting help with trying out different weights.

I think there's probably an active club scene in Norway as well, so there might well be a very efficient second hand market - worth asking around.

And most important of all, remember to have fun

 

[mariosx]

Plenty of good advice already here, but chiming in nevertheless (from Finland, next door). A preliminary welcome to the world of cold water diving!

First, forget the wetsuit. A lot of people say they'll use a 7 mil for summer stuff, but almost none actually do after getting a drysuit.

Tanks: Double 12L 232bar steel with concave bottom is very popular and easy to manage, but the non-concave option is good as well. Steer away from 200bar steel bottles.

Wing: 40lbs donut is great for D12 + one stage. The 60lbs wing is needed with double 18L tanks or if hauling lots of stages and other stuff, but is unwieldy with D12.

Regs: You deffo want environmentally sealed regs. Nothing fun in freeflows which won't go away. Apeks is a safe bet, and you can easily use 20+ year old second-hand regs if they've been serviced - or go for the newer ones with better hose routing.

Suit: There are a lot of good options, but if you are looking for a suit to use first in Europe for 2 years and then in the US, I'd go with Santi due to the service support on both sides of the pond.

Seals: Exchangable silicone seals are the way to go. Santi has a brilliant smart seals system for the gloves (it's odd how good it is despite being completely flexible) and you can have a neck ring as well fitted to the suit, definately worth it.

Undersuit: A merino wool base layer is great. With drysuits, you can layer up in winter and switch to a lighter undersuit in the summer. A lot of people swear by the Santi bz400 undergarments, but Weezle makes very warm ones as well, and there are other brands as well. Hestra liner gloves are great. Get ready to use double wooly socks in your booties.

Heating and P-valve: Contrary to some of the other comments here, I'd not rush with these. Learn to dive the drysuit first, then worry about these - they are easy to add on afterwards. Or if you get a good deal on a built-in P-valve, take it, but don't worry about using it until you feel the need for it. I use my valve on perhaps 1/3 of my dives, moreso in the summer when hydration is trickier. Heating for 1/3 dives, moreso in the winter.

Weighting: Drysuit weighting is indeed different from wetsuit weighting. I'd suggest getting a drysuit primer from someone and getting help with trying out different weights.

I think there's probably an active club scene in Norway as well, so there might well be a very efficient second hand market - worth asking around.

And most important of all, remember to have fun

Wow. Awesome comment, future neighbor.

You covered pretty much everything. When I order everything I will provide a detailed description of my setup to assist future readers here (assuming they dig past youe comment).

I have a small question on a detail, that you or anybody might elaborate from their experience.
I am looking at the Apeks DST or DS4, and I am expected to dive doubles, as mentioned in the first post. I have spotted a nice deal to get a full new set of DS4 for doubles for only 600E (excluding spg) but some buddies (not diving cold water) warn me on potential routing issues for the necklace that might cause discomfort. Have you noticed anything like that? Would it be for best to spent some more bucks for the DST?

In Trondheim the local GUE club is 5 blocks away from my workplace. I literally plan to dive if possible 4 times a week. I ll be contacting some local buddies tomorrow to see also their takes. The next weeks I will also check with the local GUE instructor for a drysuit primer class the sooner possible. I just feel bad for the kind souls that will accept to dive with me the first few times...

 

[ahereng]

Hi,
Depending on how much weight you need, a Halcyon40 could be enough. If you keep all your weights on your rig, as many here do, a 40lbs wing might not keep the rig floating if you have to remove the rig to climb aboard a boat. As mentioned earlier the Halcyon60 is big, so a much used wing here is the Tecline50 which will keep your rig floating without getting too big.

A lot of people use DS4's for doubles, but the routing for the necklace isn't perfect. Personally I use a 90deg angle for this, but this might not be DIR. Apeks, Halcyon/Scubapro are easily serviced in Norway.

If you're aiming for tech the go-to tanks are steel double 12 232bar. If diving doubles for rec, a good choice is also the steel double 8,5 232bar. Aluminum tanks are for deco/stages.

 

[mariosx]

Hi,
Depending on how much weight you need, a Halcyon40 could be enough. If you keep all your weights on your rig, as many here do, a 40lbs wing might not keep the rig floating if you have to remove the rig to climb aboard a boat. As mentioned earlier the Halcyon60 is big, so a much used wing here is the Tecline50 which will keep your rig floating without getting too big.

A lot of people use DS4's for doubles, but the routing for the necklace isn't perfect. Personally I use a 90deg angle for this, but this might not be DIR. Apeks, Halcyon/Scubapro are easily serviced in Norway.

If you're aiming for tech the go-to tanks are steel double 12 232bar. If diving doubles for rec, a good choice is also the steel double 8,5 232bar. Aluminum tanks are for deco/stages.

Awesome. Thanks. I guess I will try to save some money for DST's. I think I might start with Halcyon40, although for sure I will get in the future a Halcyon60 for stages and for 104s that are used in Florida.

 

[Buritaani]

I have a small question on a detail, that you or anybody might elaborate from their experience.
I am looking at the Apeks DST or DS4, and I am expected to dive doubles, as mentioned in the first post. I have spotted a nice deal to get a full new set of DS4 for doubles for only 600E (excluding spg) but some buddies (not diving cold water) warn me on potential routing issues for the necklace that might cause discomfort. Have you noticed anything like that? Would it be for best to spent some more bucks for the DST?

DS4's are quite fine and the most common around here. They do route quite directly down so indeed not optimal for the necklace reg or the wing inflator. TEK3 regs from Apeks are even more directly downwards. So indeed, many people (myself included) have opted for DSTs. But the important point is that in addition to getting the DST, you also need to get the 5th port addition for it!
In fact, for backgas regs, a better option would be to get the more compact newer FSR or MTX-R regs with the 5th port - a DST+5th port is a huge block of metal. But they pretty much breathe the same, so it's not a big difference, and a DS4 set is quite fine as well - you just might need to swap out the necklace hose after 5 instead of 10 years

In Trondheim the local GUE club is 5 blocks away from my workplace. I literally plan to dive if possible 4 times a week. I ll be contacting some local buddies tomorrow to see also their takes. The next weeks I will also check with the local GUE instructor for a drysuit primer class the sooner possible. I just feel bad for the kind souls that will accept to dive with me the first few times...

My experience is that helping people find new skills and achieve new levels of comfort in the water is one of the best things this hobby has to offer, so I wouldn't worry about that

I'll also chime in that D8.5L tanks are indeed wonderful, especially for RIB diving as they're a lot easier to operate on surface and still hold quite a bit of gas. They're on-par with D12 in the water for trim. I used to have a pair and loved them.

As for the wings, one thing I neglected to account for is that Norway is salty seawater diving so bouyancy can be different from the Baltic sea - if locals prefer 50lbs, then perhaps that is best - but at least in Finland, it's 40lbs for D12, 60lbs for D18.

 

[mariosx]

DS4's are quite fine and the most common around here. They do route quite directly down so indeed not optimal for the necklace reg or the wing inflator. TEK3 regs from Apeks are even more directly downwards. So indeed, many people (myself included) have opted for DSTs. But the important point is that in addition to getting the DST, you also need to get the 5th port addition for it!
In fact, for backgas regs, a better option would be to get the more compact newer FSR or MTX-R regs with the 5th port - a DST+5th port is a huge block of metal. But they pretty much breathe the same, so it's not a big difference, and a DS4 set is quite fine as well - you just might need to swap out the necklace hose after 5 instead of 10 years

Awesome insight. Then I guess I will start looking towards MTX-R(C).

My experience is that helping people find new skills and achieve new levels of comfort in the water is one of the best things this hobby has to offer, so I wouldn't worry about that

Same goes for me, and most people I have met in GUE, but not all. Still, a preemptive apology is necessary, knowing myself.

I'll also chime in that D8.5L tanks are indeed wonderful, especially for RIB diving as they're a lot easier to operate on surface and still hold quite a bit of gas. They're on-par with D12 in the water for trim. I used to have a pair and loved them.

Well, I forgot to mention that I am a big guy, still very new to the sport (less than 70 dives) and my SAC rate still SACs sucks. I would go for RB80s if I could. So, I think I will stick with D12, given that the D18s seem an overkill for most of my dives, and very bulky to manipulate outside the water. I expect most of my dives the first 6-9 months to be for my research in a big pool, where i might need to get in and out frequently. Yeah, I could opt for a single setup, but I hope I could practice at the same time for buoyancy and trim.

As for the wings, one thing I neglected to account for is that Norway is salty seawater diving so bouyancy can be different from the Baltic sea - if locals prefer 50lbs, then perhaps that is best - but at least in Finland, it's 40lbs for D12, 60lbs for D18.

I might be getting something worng here. Wouldn't lower salinity in the water indicating need for a higher volume wing? Meaning that in the Baltic sea there might be requirment for larger wings than for the north-atlantic. That was an academic question, I will bindly follow the recommendation from the locals to be honest.