Cheap regulators, scuba consumerism

[Hobbs]

I can agree with what most ppl say here.
YES the stuff have not realy improved as much as one would think.
BUT there is a reason to buy new gear, if you can afford it.

At a service you do not check for a lot of problems such as cracks in the hardware.
so an "old" regulator is more "dangerous" than a new one.
of course if you happen to see it or realize that something is amiss then you will of course change the parts for it..
BUT mind that not all parts on the inside is beeing replaced at a service, and it is not x-rayd for cracks or changes in the material.

having said that I must also conffess that I myself also have and use a first stage that is from aprox 1962-64 the manufactorer thinks. (they didnt put serial nr on at that time) so its about 10 years older than me ;-) and has 22 years on me in diving.
But I would not dive with it as a breathing first stage today.
way to bad, performance wise. but for filling mu suit its just fine, smaller than most new ones and very nice. but spare parts for it is impossible to find.

same thing with cyklon 2 nd stage I have, all metal casing and everything is like a new cyklon, exept for one thing, the piece you bite is not rubber or silicon, its hard plastic.
how´s that for a headace ! yes I could change it but that would not be the same that I started out diving with. so I have it for sentimental reasons.

potring ! thats both the best I have ever dove with and the worst !
actually its the safest, couse when you reached the surface you could not go wrong side up or flip over how hard you tried !
today i dive a wing and i have checked for me it will turn over and i WILL drown if i get unconsious on my way to the surface, hows that for safety improvement !
but the potring was also the worst piece of crap when you had your tanks strapped on and the lungs between the lifting bladder and the tanks..
breathing IN could be "hard worked" but out was no biggie.
how many heart attacks did that induce ??
of course in those days dry suit was not an option.. not for me atleast.

so yes things have improved, and it IS better to buy new things IF you have the money. warrantys is just one of them.

Bottom line is:
There are times/things where you CAN cut corners
BUT there are also things that you would want to spend on, fx your regulators
after all thats what keeps you alive down there.

I would not go buy a regulator that is 20 years old, but i would buy a tank and regulator that is 2-3 and considering the valuedrop is the most just out the door of the shop thats where you would make the most of your money.

 

[MikeFerrara]

I dive with a Conshelf regulator I bought in 1974.

I just bought a 20 year old tank and regulator for my wife, had it serviced, and we're off. Total cost, less than $100, and I'll bet your regulator doesn't breath any better (but is probably lighter on land). I'll also bet your dives aren't any better than mine for having bought into the contemporary scuba marketing machine. These are simple devices. There's a lot of deep tech talk about technology improvements, but in a practical sense regs have not changed much in the past few decades.

Ciao

Regs haven't changed very much. However a balanced reg certainly breathed better than an unbalanced reg and I prefer a balanced second stage as well.

You didn't say what kind of tank you got but if you baught an old AL tank you may not have gotten such a good deal.

 

[BlueDevil]

I started diving 25 years ago with a US Divers Calypso, which was regarded as top of the range at the time (mine was the version without the built in J-valve). It was a great reg back then, but i wouldn't want to use it these days. Just before I pensioned it off it was getting noticeably difficult to breath off if i didn't have it serviced right on 12 months. Compared to the regs i use now it was pretty ordinary (but it served me well on many very good dives in the past - still have it in the back of a cupboard as a momento of my earlier days)

 

[bigredbill]

At a service you do not check for a lot of problems such as cracks in the hardware.
so an "old" regulator is more "dangerous" than a new one.
of course if you happen to see it or realize that something is amiss then you will of course change the parts for it..
BUT mind that not all parts on the inside is beeing replaced at a service, and it is not x-rayd for cracks or changes in the material.

If whoever is doing your service is not inspecting the reg for cracks with a magnifying glass you better take your service elsewhere. It should be standard procedure. BTW, this is never done with a "brand new reg" and probably is a low liability issue, but a reg going thru annual should be rather closely examined.

 

[Groundhog246]

At a service you do not check for a lot of problems such as cracks in the hardware.
so an "old" regulator is more "dangerous" than a new one.
of course if you happen to see it or realize that something is amiss then you will of course change the parts for it..
BUT mind that not all parts on the inside is beeing replaced at a service, and it is not x-rayd for cracks or changes in the material.

This sounds like a dealer and a bad one at that. I own 2 Aqualung (US DIvers actually) Conshelf 21 set and one Conshelf SE set as well as a much newer Micra set. 2 years ago the LDS I use found some cracks in the plastic housing on one of the 21's. Apparently a "known" issue way back and housings were replaced with an upgraded part. He made a couple of call, located the required new parts (which apparently are now very scarce) and finished up. All told, I think the new housings added $30 to the annual bill.
No, they don't X-ray them, but they sure give them a close look over. Since they same staff are also doing VIP+ on my AL80's (including an old alloy one), I would hope they are always paying attention to the details.

If you think we should all be buying new regs, how long do YOU think they're good for? My expectation is that if the manufacturer thought a 10 or 15 or 20 year old reg was no longer trustworthy and really needed replacement, then they'd stop providing parts, including rebuild kits for annual service.

 

[salimbag]

Steel tank. Balanced regs have pretty much been standard since, I think, probably the late fifties. Although most companies sold an unbalanced "cheap" model well into the sixties.

Buying used scuba is like buying used anything. The more you know the more you can save. That's why these forums are so great. I once bought one of the early US Divers 80 cu ft aluminum tanks for a song, only to find that is was serious positive bouyant when full!

Used regs? There are so many old standards, Conshelf, Mark V (I used to own one of those as well) that there isn't much risk here. Just get it serviced. Rebuilt is, I think, good as new in terms of reliability.

 

[salimbag]

Sorry the above post was in reply to the following, which I forgot copy: "Regs haven't changed very much. However a balanced reg certainly breathed better than an unbalanced reg and I prefer a balanced second stage as well.

You didn't say what kind of tank you got but if you baught an old AL tank you may not have gotten such a good deal."

 

[salimbag]

I'm the happy misguided soul who started this threat and it is great fun. The point I started with, which I'd like to reiterate is:

Buy what you want new or used, simple or overkill, and don't feel as though you need to apologize for it. But when making your purchasing decisions be aware that there are economical, "classic" alternatives. Too often we don't take that into account in our consumer-driven universe. It's all good as long as you are having fun or working for a better world.

 

[simbrooks]

I could understand the complaint about not changing regs etc up every year or two (i know people who do that with cars and some (with lots of cash) that do it with large sailing yachts), but if you buy a new reg and use it for at least 10 years then you have got a good load of use out of it surely by then? The latest,greatest is all well to look at and know about when time comes for a replacement, but some of this old stuff is good for "vintage diving days", but do you really test it, take it deep, or just for shallow, none stressful stuff?

I can also understand about the LDS's changing their tunes on stuff they carry, that is their business, however they should think through how they state this a little more before completely slating something.

Personally i hate shopping around forever just to keep waiting to get the greatest deal, you can wait until the end of the world for those magic prices! I buy things that are a good deal for something i would like or need, i will look for a price that seems as low, if not the lowest in my area (inc online) on anything (not just scuba stuff) when i need it. I have had old cars, mostly they havent been looked after all that well, some minor stuff to repair and on we go for a few years, usually they then need to be replaced with another old one after that. Sometimes that vicious circle needs to be broken though.

BTW, buy whatever you want AND put money towards the any ocean conservation organisation.

 

[salimbag]

Am I right in believing that ANY regulator that is completely and competently overhauled and then regularly serviced should be no problem? Some may say that there is the risk that there may be a problem with the overhaul, but, hey, there's also the risk of something defective new out of the box, and I think that risk is not a lot less.