Question CCR for recreational depths

[TuckerIdaho]

This is turning into the same conversation you see with boat ownership cost all the time.

CCRs are not cheap to own, are there exceptions? Sure, are they the rule? No.
Either you can afford it comfortably or you can't.

 

[Angelo Farina]

Having experienced the transition from a world where CCR was the most common, cheap and widespread scuba system to a world dominated by OC air tanks, I think that we will not easily switch back to the CCR being the dominant system for training new divers and do shallow dives.

 

[CT-Rich]

@CT-Rich
But why do you think virtually nobody bought a Dolphin or a Poseidon or any of the other rigs for rec diving?
Apparently a KISS Spirit was only 5 grand... I never see those anywhere in the wild. I'm not even sure I've ever seen a Spirit or a Poseidon at a dive site.

Why would you what a rebreather for rec diving anyways?

Let's see, why would I want the ability bring one rig to a dive site and be able get in four or five hours of diving and being able explore an area without worrying about my turn pressure and keeping enough reserve? Would I rather just go out once and focus the objective of the dive and not on what making sure I get something done before I need to head back in? On a typical shore dive to say 40' I may have a 15 minute swim to the drop point, another 15 minutes out and another 15 minutes back. half the dive is used up just get where I wanted to be. With a rebreather you have the exact same entry and exit, but pretty much unlimited time on station.

You are confusing past failures with future success. The first cars were not that great. There was little to no infrastructure to support them, no paved roads, no gas stations, in some places you had to have someone walk ahead of the car with a warning lamp at night.

Eventually the masses saw the benefit, the engineering got better, the infrastructure grew around it. Ford realized that cars could be marketed on scale to bring the price down. Modern OC diving is vastly more expensive than it was in the 1950s. I have some vintage gear and my daughter look at me with horror every time she sees me putting it in the car. Modern gear is way more complex and far more expensive than what Mike Nelson used on Sea Hunt and nobody complains.

I am looking at the trend, not the track record. Gear keeps changing, why wouldn't i be interested in technology that makes diving more interesting?

 

[L13]

Having experienced the transition from a world where CCR was the most common, cheap and widespread scuba system to a world dominated by OC air tanks, I think that we will not easily switch back to the CCR being the dominant system for training new divers and do shallow dives.

I think you are right that it will not be easy. My guess would be 20 years or more. But I do think it will happen. I think CCR is where Nitrox was in the early 1990's. I think in another decade or so, Nitrox will at least be taught as part of AOW if not OW. And a decade or two after that, CCR will be as common as Nitrox is now.

 

[berndo]

You are confusing past failures with future success.

They didn't fail because their design sucked. People don't want to pay more to have more work and the hassle with sorb and o2 when they can just put a reg on a tank and go. I don't think many people want to do 3 or 4 hour dives.

Whatever you improve on the design you wont get around cleaning counter lungs and hoses, having to source and change scrubbers, having to bring BO gas, etc.

 

[broncobowsher]

Poseiden had this exact same thinking when then released their "recreational" CC unit... Didn't happen.
Mares/Revo had the exact same thinking when they released their "recreational SCR" again, didnt happen.

Pretty sure the era of OW recreational CCR/SCR isnt going to happen

Don't forget the Hollis SCR recreational failure. If anyone had the resources to put a rebreather into the mass market the Explorer would have done it. They did put a bunch of them out in the wild. Yet another failed recreational rebreather. Yes, Huish pulled the plug on it when they bought Hollis, but it was struggling before the Huish euthanasian.

 

[CT-Rich]

I think you are right that it will not be easy. My guess would be 20 years or more. But I do think it will happen. I think CCR is where Nitrox was in the early 1990's. I think in another decade or so, Nitrox will at least be taught as part of AOW if not OW. And a decade or two after that, CCR will be as common as Nitrox is now.

I think Rebreather diving will completely take over the current tech market in the next ten years. When you compare the current area that multicylinder tech diving sits in right now. CCR will pretty much take over that space. People will expect divers to become CCR proficient before they start cave training, wreck penetration and deco diving. That will encourage more interest in simpler SCR, mCCR diving earlier.

Right now, tech diving goes the other direction. Divers are getting Tech/deco/cave certified and graduating to rebreathers. I think as the technology develops it will flip around. Agencies will want to know that you are proficient on Rebreather diving before they train you on cave diving or deco diving.

Currently, how many hours of non- technical diving do they recommend on a rebreather before using it for deco?

 

[TuckerIdaho]

Currently, how many hours of non- technical diving do they recommend on a rebreather before using it for deco?

30-50 depending on your OC experience. (TDI)

There won't be a flip of "CCR first then cave/deco". It's a whole different beast that requires a different mindset completely.

 

[rjack321]

Don't forget the Hollis SCR recreational failure. If anyone had the resources to put a rebreather into the mass market the Explorer would have done it. They did put a bunch of them out in the wild. Yet another failed recreational rebreather. Yes, Huish pulled the plug on it when they bought Hollis, but it was struggling before the Huish euthanasian.

Good point, forgot about that 3rd one

 

[berndo]

I think as the technology develops it will flip around.

What technologies do you see comming though? Scuba gear has hardly changed and works pretty well. Regs, BCs, suits, fins, etc. are basically the same stuff we had 30 or 40 years ago.

Rebreathers are basically a filter in a bucket, one or two bags, hoses and some form of relatively simple gas addition. It works and is fairly basic. There is going to be incremental improvement of components but I don't see any big jumps and I don't think we have seen any big jumps in the past either. A rebreather has inherent downsides: Needs to be cleaned, need fresh filter material, needs an electronic gas analysis/monitoring type of device and more training than OC. I don't see how you're getting around those inherent downsides.