Cavern...

[Meng_Tze]

This 'doubles at Ginnie' has been covered several times.

To clarify.

Ginnie adheres to and implements limitations based on agency standards. If you show up with a certification that specifies doubles at your level, you are allowed to dive doubles.

I can only speak for cave diving certifications from NACD. At the intro level you are certified only to single tanks, even if you did the course in doubles. With a discretionary apprentice (to be obtained from your instructor) you are allowed to dive doubles. Ginnie will thus allow you to dive doubles as well.

Hope this clarifies the position. I have been there and done it (been sent away for 'trying to dive doubles when not certified to').

I agree that if this is a discussion that needs to continue, someone should start a new thread.

 

[SuPrBuGmAn]

So does your Intro card not state "doubles" or does Ginnie not allow TDI Intro divers to dive doubles regardless of what the card says?

I have IANTD Intro and our card specifically says in Doubles. I don't have a specific permission slip just the card that states doubles on it. I don't know how else and agency would differentiate if the standards allow but don't require doubles.

I imagine my card should be no problem for Ginnie (although I have not tried it yet).

Miranda

TDI doesn't differentiat between single and double tank divers at Intro Level, they let you take the course in whichever setup you'd like. Doubles are allowed by TDI even at the cavern level, with no special provisions. Doubles are mandatory in TDI's curriculum from Full Cave(there is no Apprentice).

I took TDI cavern and Intro in doubles. Am I not going to be allowed to dive them at Ginnie?

Not without a permission slip of some sorts I'd imagine.

This 'doubles at Ginnie' has been covered several times.

To clarify.

Ginnie adheres to and implements limitations based on agency standards. If you show up with a certification that specifies doubles at your level, you are allowed to dive doubles.

I can only speak for cave diving certifications from NACD. At the intro level you are certified only to single tanks, even if you did the course in doubles. With a discretionary apprentice (to be obtained from your instructor) you are allowed to dive doubles. Ginnie will thus allow you to dive doubles as well.

BS.

Ginnie only adheres to certain agency implemented limitations. TDI doesn't limit cavern/Intro divers to single tanks, there is no discretionary doubles application. You choose which setup you want to take the certification in and do it. Ginnie does not adhere to TDI's standards and instead disallows doubles at Intro Level for TDI card holders. I believe they will take a permission slip from an instructor.

To dive with doubles, you'll need a card which specifies doubles(which not all agencies differentiate - as their standards don't), or be NACD with the permission slip.

So no, Ginnie does not adhere to limitations set in place by agency standards, unless you are part of a certain agency

 

[Rich Courtney]

To dive with doubles, you'll need a card which specifies doubles(which not all agencies differentiate - as their standards don't), or be NACD with the permission slip.

So no, Ginnie does not adhere to limitations set in place by agency standards, unless you are part of a certain agency

Alright this is getting silly, Ginnie adhere's to the NACD, NSS-CDS and now NAUI & GUE standards. NACD Intro divers are not allowed to dive doubles (since that's what their training standards say), NSS-CDS Basic Cave divers are allowed to dive doubles (since that's what their training standards say), NAUI Cave 1 divers are allowed to dive doubles (since that's what their training standards say), GUE Cave 1 divers are allowed to dive doubles (since that's what their training standards say).

I also saw in this thread that you are not allowed to take Cavern/Intro in doubles. This is pure BS, it is at the instructor's discretion...... Am I going to allow someone to take a Cavern/Intro course from me in doubles if they've never dove doubles before? Probably not, but if they have experience in doubles I will highly encourage it!

The unfortunate thing that happens is that for some strange reason, people think that Cavern/Intro or App/Full is a great place to learn to dive doubles and then they wonder why they don't pass...

Most cave instructors can teach both cave agencies (by that I mean NACD & NSS-CDS) so if you're NACD certified at the Intro level, simply get your instructor to issue you a Basic Cave card or heaven forbid, step up to the plate and sign up for an App/Full class in which case you'll get a waiver!

I end up issuing my students whatever card(s) they want, but remember if you take Cavern/Intro in a single tank, don't expect to be diving doubles without some form of a checkout dive from a cave instructor!

Hope everyone's having a great Thanksgiving.....

Safe diving,

Rich

 

[SuPrBuGmAn]

Thats the point, TDI doesn't have a doubles Intro Card, Ginnie doesn't know(or atleast acknowledge their standards of allowing doubles) so is becomes an issue.

Plenty of other sites in the area to dive that don't give a rats butt about what tanks you use, to me thats the easiest option as ponying up for Full Cave isn't in my budget at this time.

 

[cmufieldhockey8]

I don't think the original poster is interested in anything but a cavern class for now so he may not have to worry about this Ginnie issue yet. I am wondering if any cavern cards allow doubles.

I've only farted around the eye as an open water diver watching the cave divers go in and out and the cavern didn't look like much. Is there much of a cavern to dive in the ear?

 

[BabyDuck]

no, not at all. the eye is better, but even that ain't all that. the ballroom is definitely the best caverny part of ginnie. or drop into little devil, that's pretty cool & not an overhead.

 

[cmufieldhockey8]

Right so it seems for the purpose of this thread, this issue of doubles at Ginnie is irrelevant since it's not likely our friend Scubastud will be diving the devil's system too often.

The ballroom was the first cavern I ever dove, and I've been dreaming of caves ever since!

 

[Scubastud16]

Thanks BD, I'll probably be heading there soon after getting cavern (have several friends who live in the area....aka free room and board for the weekend ).

 

[SuPrBuGmAn]

I don't think the original poster is interested in anything but a cavern class for now so he may not have to worry about this Ginnie issue yet. I am wondering if any cavern cards allow doubles.

TDI allows doubles at the cavern level :14: Course, that does nobody any good at Ginnie.

 

[willardj]

Like was said earlyer. There is to many other Spring's out there than just Ginnie.