BP/W Now what?

[liuk3]

I found this book helpful when I was just starting out and trying to get setup.

"Dress for Success"
Dress for Success | Global Underwater Explorers

 

[Gombessa]

Some parts of my rig are from the LDS, others were purchased used.

I'm just saying, the repeat business argument doesn't fly for me; if the LDS predicates its business on stocking your ever-increasing needs each step of the way, the worst time to lose your business would be at the high end, once you've established yourself as a repeat-customer and big spender, by sending you somewhere else when you're ready to go doubles/bpw/etc.

I'm not a crazy gear guy like many of the locals here who have redundant drysuits and can lights and 20+ tanks in the garage, but even after my main kit was purchased, assembled, and optimized, I've still given my LDS upwards of hundreds of dollars a month in miscellany that I've needed - from fills to hoses to extra parts and replacement gear.

I just don't think it reflects reality to say that shops refuse to stock bp/ws because they believe they'll lose an opportunity to charge for intermediary stuff that the bp/w renders irrelevant. A mistaken belief that "there's no profitable market" is probably more in-line with reality.

 

[Sas]

Some parts of my rig are from the LDS, others were purchased used.

I'm just saying, the repeat business argument doesn't fly for me; if the LDS predicates its business on stocking your ever-increasing needs each step of the way, the worst time to lose your business would be at the high end, once you've established yourself as a repeat-customer and big spender, by sending you somewhere else when you're ready to go doubles/bpw/etc.

Yes you are correct, it is the worst time to lose business but most people drop out of diving so LDSs (the bad ones and the one I did my OW with is like this) seem to run their business as follows:
1. get people into OW
2. flog them very overpriced gear that they don't need but don't know this due to being new and ignorant
3. if they stick around try to flog them replacements for the gear they did not need when they cotton on to what is more appropriate gear

3 is not likely to be successful but this might not matter to them as they might get more money from steps 1-2 than if they were to sell students more appropriate gear from the start and count on people turning into big spenders (not many do, as I said, most do not stick around in diving much longer than OW). I know my BP/W was over $400 cheaper than the BC the first LDS I used sold me so I would have been better off to buy that from the start. As soon as they found out I wanted a BP/W replacement they were VERY keen to sell me a BP/W but by that stage I'd gotten to the point where if I never go into that store again it will be too soon. The shop I got my BP/W off in the end actually only has BP/Ws on display in the store. Though they have other style BCs on their website so I presume they sell those as well, but their main selling point for BCs tends to be a BP/W so not all shops are ignorant of this type of setup.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Some parts of my rig are from the LDS, others were purchased used.

I'm just saying, the repeat business argument doesn't fly for me; if the LDS predicates its business on stocking your ever-increasing needs each step of the way, the worst time to lose your business would be at the high end, once you've established yourself as a repeat-customer and big spender, by sending you somewhere else when you're ready to go doubles/bpw/etc.

I'm not a crazy gear guy like many of the locals here who have redundant drysuits and can lights and 20+ tanks in the garage, but even after my main kit was purchased, assembled, and optimized, I've still given my LDS upwards of hundreds of dollars a month in miscellany that I've needed - from fills to hoses to extra parts and replacement gear.

I just don't think it reflects reality to say that shops refuse to stock bp/ws because they believe they'll lose an opportunity to charge for intermediary stuff that the bp/w renders irrelevant. A mistaken belief that "there's no profitable market" is probably more in-line with reality.

I think it's some of both, they make more money on regular stuff and they think there is no profitable market. No profitable market??? All you have to do is look around and see how many people are using BP/W set ups of various types and get on any internet board. The problem is they chose not to cultivate a market. They have no one in there familiar with using them or trying to turn people to them. They at least have to make an effort to learn about them and get their instructors using them. Of course there not going to be a market unless they promote them.
People who want a BP/W are going to get one somewhere. Even if the shop made 50% markup on it is better than nothing at all, at least they would get a sale. They choose nothing at all.

I walked into one of my LDS's the other day and looked around. I realized there is actually very little they have that I use. A wall of s5 different types of split fins and one paddle fin with some sort of weird hinge in the middle?, a few aluminum tanks on the floor, racks of stretchy wetsuits, racks of dingly dangly retractor gizmos, dive computers ranging from 500 up to 1500 dollars,
a wall of poodle jackets.
The only thing I could use was their regulators, weights/ weightbelts, air, they had a good pair of booties, that's about it.

 

[Gombessa]

The problem is they chose not to cultivate a market. They have no one in there familiar with using them or trying to turn people to them. They at least have to make an effort to learn about them and get their instructors using them.

I agree, they're either sorely misinformed, or we are. Either way, most LDSs choose to pick only the low-hanging fruit of introductory, consumer-level BCs, and that's a shame.

 

[tridacna]

What I'm suggesting, (to get back on subject), is that it would be nice if somehow the members of SB who seem to have a wealth of experience with BP/Ws, could produce a document of some kind that could help beginners with BP/W selection, instruction in set up and use. The GUE stuff is nice but not really aimed at beginners. I'm also pretty sure that most beginners do not want to go DIR.

Think about it: Any time that a newbie asks a question about BCD selection, they are instantly greeted with a choir of "Why a BP/W is so much better". And then nothing more.

 

[lord.harshil]

What I'm suggesting, (to get back on subject), is that it would be nice if somehow the members of SB who seem to have a wealth of experience with BP/Ws, could produce a document of some kind that could help beginners with BP/W selection, instruction in set up and use. The GUE stuff is nice but not really aimed at beginners. I'm also pretty sure that most beginners do not want to go DIR.

Think about it: Any time that a newbie asks a question about BCD selection, they are instantly greeted with a choir of "Why a BP/W is so much better". And then nothing more.

I second that.

But I'm too inexperienced on this site (read: lazy) and in the diving world (read : I'd rather be diving) to make one

 

[DaleC]

The GUE stuff is nice but not really aimed at beginners. I'm also pretty sure that most beginners do not want to go DIR.

For the most part, GUE/DIR uses a basic hogarthian configuration for BP/W rigging. It's not their idea. It will serve anyone regardless of their agency affiliation. About the only difference one might make is to add a left shoulder quick release (not needed IMO) or a right hip D ring (if you don't mount a canlight).

 

[Goindrinkn]

For the OP - After struggling a bit myself, I found a great video on ScubaToys u-tube channel on how to rig the plate. (I can't hit it from here or i'd post the link) It was helpful to see it done and I was able to struggle though it. The worse part was actually the buckle! If anyone's creating a list I'd take a look at the video.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

What I'm suggesting, (to get back on subject), is that it would be nice if somehow the members of SB who seem to have a wealth of experience with BP/Ws, could produce a document of some kind that could help beginners with BP/W selection, instruction in set up and use. The GUE stuff is nice but not really aimed at beginners. I'm also pretty sure that most beginners do not want to go DIR.

Think about it: Any time that a newbie asks a question about BCD selection, they are instantly greeted with a choir of "Why a BP/W is so much better". And then nothing more.

I have a vested interest in this discussion myself because I do some small scale manufacturing of a plate (I'm not ashamed to say) so this topic is dear to my heart.
Back when I tried to intruduce my product into dive shops I pretty much had the door slammed in my face. It's almost like they took it personal, it was bizzaar.
In the mean time I have saturated my local community with dozens of plates and wings. I think the dive shops took it a little personal and resent me for it, oh well. I took food out of their mouths. But I did go to them first and they were to stupid and arrogant to see the concept.

So getting back to the OP's question or comment about an instruction sheet or dvd about the set up, use, and maintenance in the use of BP/W for the beginning recreational diver, that's a great idea.
Yeah, you're right, you'll never get that info through an LDS because they don't know (not all but most). So, your option for now is to keep on us here on SB and we'll walk you through it.