Blowing off Steam

[Snoweman]

Turned out she was an aerobics instructor and the ensuing argument found us dating.

That's AWESOME!!

It’s all just compensatory facade anyway, the poor guys are just jealous of our air consumption. ;-)

You ain't kidding!

 

[Schwob]

the poor guys are

... definitely guilty as charged...

 

[aquacat8]

Perhaps some of this is the universal, even cross-species, falling down embarrassment, so next time maybe just say “I meant to do that!”

 

[RyanT]

When they introduced themselves, they said, " ... and we are proud to be Latina engineers!" My first thought was why can't they just call themselves engineers?

Maybe I can shed a little light. Even here in the 21st century, the hurdles for women in science and engineering are higher than they are for men. Those hurdles are higher yet again for minorities. So being proud to be a Latina engineer is being proud of what they have achieved in spite of having had the sh*t kicked out of them at every turn along the way. For them, it may well have been achieving a dream that was next to impossible.

 

[Gareth J]

Or people assuming that you need help even when you've got about 200 more dives under your belt then the fella trying to help you.

I don't really care if you are pink martian with yellow spots. I am going to help get people in and out of the water, the boat, etc. I've seen too many injuries due to 'macho' individuals carrying heavy kit - in the best case I loose a dive, the worst someone gets properly hurt.

We share the loading of the boat. (Except you carry your own twinset, or CCR - we will help you transition from the boat to the dock or the dock to the boat).
We help people kit up.
Most importantly, we help people move around the deck - to the exit and back.
We help people de-kit, we unclip stages, we remove fins. (Priority - stages, fins, seat).

I've got somewhere between 1000 and 2000 dives. Any help I get I'm very pleased to receive.

We often get compliments from skippers, that we are quick at loading and unloading boats, minimal fuss to have on the boat, and easy to have on board because we look after our team. The skipper gets an easy life, we get good diving and arrive before slack.

I don't like having to Medivac people off dive boats, its very stressful. Its bad enough for DCI, its stupid for a broken leg because someone fell over on the boat being macho.

If you look like you need help - I'm going to offer. You can always refuse, unless you are putting the rest off us at risk - then you are going to get it anyway.

Gareth

 

[Gareth J]

I thought I would add a second post. This is not specifically 'on topic' but close.

As a general rule most of the experienced female divers I have dived with have been excellent divers (not always excellent buddies, some have also been photographers!). One major advantage is generally less ego and less macho in their approach and attitude. This has meant that my general attitude of sharing the 'lifting', and helping with the kitting up and de-kitting has been seen as a positive.
(When i say helping with kitting up, we are talking about fitting fins, stages etc. Not fiddling with other people dive kit).

I put the helping with the lifting, etc down to the positive training I have had. The result of being in a club environment. It has always been a club attitude that we look after each other. Probably reinforcing the 'instructor' status.

 

[admikar]

I learned a lesson on my last dive trip.
After reading threads on SB about "sexism" that help offers entail, on my last dive trip there was a petite girl. Against my ingrained habits and my better judgment, remembering what was said by few females on this board, I chose not to offer her any help with schlepping her gear on or off the boat (other guys did, though). Last day of a trip, during lunch, a large group of us is together and everybody is talking about sharing pictures and videos. It turns out, there is a FB group, so they can all share memories. After I asked how come I'm not in, she replied coldly that she's moderator and she's not letting me in since I'm a jerk. Go figure.
Lesson learned: follow my instincts, offer help. If "lady" doesn't like it, .......well, you can guess it.

 

[Lorenzoid]

@admikar , I believe you discovered the converse of the saying "no good deed goes unpunished."

 

[kmarks]

I'm not a woman, but I'm not a big guy either (not quite 5'10") and I look very young despite being in my late 30s, so I've seen my share of arrogance and puffery from other men (not just divers - I'm a photographer and woodworker, too), enough that I try to recognize and eliminate any hint of it in myself before it even starts. I will never step in a grab something out of somebody's hand or start "helping" with gear before I'm asked (barring seeing an impending injury or disaster), and I won't even offer help unless I think it is really necessary, like I could save somebody a trip by carrying their second tank or helping out with something that is clearly a two person job. That said, I will make it clear to new or obviously nervous divers (especially if they are alone) that I can help if needed, no matter who they are.

This past weekend, I went diving with two other men about my size and three women. We had a few hundred dives and about half an ego between us. The lake kind of sucked, but it was some of the best diving I've done because of the mutual respect within the group.

I love diving with almost anybody, and that includes, as @aquacat8 might say, ScubaBroads.

 

[lowflyer]

I have been following this thread with interest because I'm confused about current concepts of politeness toward women.

I'm old. In ancient times I was taught to let women first through the door, hold the door for them, hold the chair for them at a restaurant, women always first. Be helpful, etc. Never thought this approach would be offensive to some women.

Now if I hold the door for a woman (pretty, ugly, young, old, doesn't matter), rarely do I get a pleasant nod or thank you (mostly from the old ones). I more often get a surprised look or a scowl. On the other hand, if I get discouraged and don't hold the door, I feel guilty. I guess if I see a woman diver fall in the surf, thrown about by waves, I should stand around unless asked for help. I certainly don't want to be accused of copping a feel (through a wet suit and a BCD, really?)

Oh well, I guess I'll continue to do as my mother taught: be helpful without touching, not because women are inferior, but out of respect.