Attitudes Toward DIR Divers

[Lorenzoid]

I’m not referring to individual PADI instructors. I’m referring to the organization as a whole.

Then you might be more specific and point to what specifically you believe PADI the organization did wrong. You mentioned "PADI shops" you have seen. As much as the public might be led to believe otherwise, PADI does not have much if any control over the shops through which PADI courses are offered.

 

[SlugLife]

I think it’s important to distinguish between whether something is the only “correct” way and “better” ways to do things.

Minor improvement, but still comes across as an "elitist" mindset. Further, I consider "better" claims to often be wrong. For example, what is better? A sports car or a pickup truck? GUE or SideMount? Rarely is anything objectively better, as small changes in context (dive plan, environment, the diver, etc) might call for a change of plans or equipment.

I would like to join a "Doing It Wrong" group.

Doing it Left doesn't have the same pull.

Join us crazy SideMount divers, it's fun over here!

I’d argue that the long hose is necessary due to the amount of play you have if you do donate it as well as the fact that you won’t unwittingly lose control of your secondary as it’s around your neck

Ignoring the subject matter (of long-hoses), I underlined 2 words.

• Must we "argue"? Perhaps it's better to focus on the pros, cons, utility, or even context of when it's more or less useful.
• Is X really "necessary?" Or is is perhaps instead more "useful" or "beneficial"

I'm not talking about just swapping in different words, but rather a mindset of how to approach a discussion.

 

[Zach The Diver]

Then you might be more specific and point to what specifically you believe PADI the organization did wrong. You mentioned "PADI shops" you have seen. As much as the public might be led to believe otherwise, PADI does not have much if any control over the shops through which PADI courses are offered.

Diving association denies responsibility in Glacier drowning death of Missoula woman

The Professional Association of Diving Instructors Worldwide Corporation is denying vicarious responsibility for the November 2020 death of Linnea Mills, according to a document filed April 4 in Missoula County District Court.

missoulacurrent.com

 

[Zach The Diver]

Minor improvement, but still comes across as an "elitist" mindset. Further, I consider "better" claims to often be wrong. For example, what is better? A sports car or a pickup truck? GUE or SideMount? Rarely is anything objectively better, as small changes in context (dive plan, environment, the diver, etc) might call for a change of plans or equipment.

Join us crazy SideMount divers, it's fun over here!

Ignoring the subject matter (of long-hoses), I underlined 2 words.

• Must we "argue"? Perhaps it's better to focus on the pros, cons, utility, or even context of when it's more or less useful.
• Is X really "necessary?" Or is is perhaps instead more "useful" or "beneficial"

I'm not talking about just swapping in different words, but rather a mindset of how to approach a discussion.

First point you made-

That reads like we can’t have frank discussions about what might be better than something else without someone calling someone the “E Word” and taking a simple statement and transforming it into a 30+ page thread cascade like this one.

Second point-

Yes, you’re right. And maybe there is a more diplomatic way I could say certain things. My intuition tells me the reception would have likely been the same here.

 

[Lorenzoid]

Diving association denies responsibility in Glacier drowning death of Missoula woman

The Professional Association of Diving Instructors Worldwide Corporation is denying vicarious responsibility for the November 2020 death of Linnea Mills, according to a document filed April 4 in Missoula County District Court.

missoulacurrent.com

And? Many of us are familiar with the case. There was a very long thread about it.

 

[Zach The Diver]

And? Many of us are familiar with the case. There was a very long thread about it.

that’s obvious, which makes the whole cherry-picking-my-argument about PADI approach you’re taking pointless and honestly a bit disingenuous.

EVERYONE is intimately familiar with this case. EVERYONE- including PADI’s most ardent defenders- is aware of the organization’s failures and reprehensible practices.

You act like saying this is too broad of a stroke yet someone saying “GUE has no QC” in this thread is treated as if it’s a rational statement.

Ridiculous.

 

[tursiops]

EVERYONE is intimately familiar with this case.

Pure hyperbole. Nonsense, too. The hole you are digging for yourself is getting deeper and deeper.

 

[Boarderguy]

Somebody feels that PADI touched them in their nono square after paying for just that experience...

 

[Zach The Diver]

Pure hyperbole. Nonsense, too. The hole you are digging for yourself is getting deeper and deeper.

Hyperbole? What’s hyperbolic about it? That everybody knows about it? Or PADI totally didn’t hold a suspect dive shop accountable and attempt to distance themselves when a student got killed?

I could go on and on.

Let’s hear about how this is nonsense.

 

[tursiops]

Hyperbole? What’s hyperbolic about it? That everybody knows about it? Or PADI totally didn’t hold a suspect dive shop accountable and attempt to distance themselves when a student got killed?

I could go on and on.

Let’s hear about how this is nonsense.

You said: "EVERYONE is intimately familiar with this case."
I quoted that and said that is hyperbole and nonsense.