Apeks VS ScubaPro

[RTodd]

OK, I take your opinion, seriously. If then, do you think how often the regulator should be serviced to save our AXX? I know that Atomic requires every other year unlike any other major brand. Let us have your opinion in detail?

Thanks in advance,

A regulator should be serviced annually so you don't die.

Pesonally, I regularly check the IP and the general condition of regs. Once one develops a problem it goes in the box and when there are enough in the box I overhaul them. As I said before, scubapros generally make it a year after being put in service (maybe two if I don't use them much). Apex, never really fail the above tests so I only overhaul them after they have gone a ridiculously long time (5+ years). Significant ocean use would might shorten that.

Also, I detune all of my regs to an IP of around 120 - this reduces freeflows and seems to slightly extend the life of scubapros. (It is hard to get SPs to an IP this low, so just detune it as low as you can.)

 

[RTodd]

OK I'm a little lost here. You're saying that diaphram first stages are bad for stage bottles "because if they flood they don't purge the water very well". Then why wouldn't the same apply to the backup second stage?

All second stages flood. Assuming you are talking about back gas regs, you only turn off the regs on your back gas in an emergency. You turn off stage/ deco regs whenever not in use. Therefore, they are much more prone to flooding even if you don't switch bottles. Piston regs deal with being flooded better because many of the "working" parts are flooded anyway.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I agree with RTodd that an annual service is a good idea, particularly for any reg you take in an overhead environment.

I have found that SP regs will normally go well beyond the 1 year service interval and the time between servicing for some of our customers bears this out. But the number of dives is much more important than the number of months since the last service. I put about 150 dives per year on my regs and given that I dive independent doubles they are each used for about 1/2 of the time on each dive. (I also rotate the first and second stages from left to right tanks mid season to ensure equal use.) I normally get through a whole season but at the end of the seasons the regs definitely benefit from an annual service whether they need it or not. If I dove 30 dives per year, the first stages would arguably go for 5 years, but I would not advise doing that.

I have not generally had a problem getting SP regs to IP's of around 120-125 psi. You need to remove the shims and back off the seat retainer adjustmetn if present, but those steps normally work. If not, trade spings until you fnd one that is slightly lighter. On SP's Mk V and Mk 10 regs, the servcie kits come with 3 seats and one will usually get you down into that range with the shims removed.

First stages are less liekly to have something break if the first stage floods during the dive (possible on a deco bottle, unlikely on the primary or backup reg) as they are for the most part flow through designs that will push water in the first stage through. They also have no soft rubber diaphragms that could be potentially overstressed by an incompressible substance like water being present in the first stage as can occur with some diaphragm designs.

A piston reg should however still be dissassebled, rinsed and dried after this type of abuse. Unbalanced "flow by" piston designs in partiucular can trap water in the compression chamber where it is nearly impossibel to remove by running air through the reg.

 

[Tamas]

Sorry to barge in here with my question, good train of though so far with the servicing.

Here is another question I had: In one of the other threads I heard (read) someone talk about Oceanic Delta regs being used for doubles config. So what do you guys think of the new Oceanic Delta 4? Is it worth looking into?
The first stage sorta reminds me of the Mares line, but I like the size of the second stage.
Any comments on the reg?

 

[scubahound_1]

On deco/stage gear, if you pressurize bottles before dive, then turn off valve but don't purge them you shouldn't have a flooding problem whether diaphragm or piston. Common sense to me but correct me if I am wrong on this.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

On deco/stage gear, if you pressurize bottles before dive, then turn off valve but don't purge them you shouldn't have a flooding problem whether diaphragm or piston. Common sense to me but correct me if I am wrong on this.

That's what I do and it works as long as the purge does not get bumped. When you pressurize it, the reg will be filled with intermediate pressure air all the way to the second stage poppet. If the purge does get bumped, it has to get bumped enough to drain the whole system to ambient pressure. Then you'd have to go substantially deeper and bump the purge again to draw water past the second stage poppet. It would require you to be a great deal deeper to draw water far enough up the hose to reach the first stage, but with even a small amount of water in the second stage hose, if you inverted the deco bottle water would run up the hose to the first stage.

So it is possible to get water in the first stage, but not all that likely. I have small button gauges on my deco regs and periodically check them during the dive. If they are showing less than full, a quick on and off with the valve will fill the system again.

If you have a deco reg that fails, it is theoretically possible to swap a reg from one tank to another underwater. This will definitely flood the first stage and would be an option of last resort (ie. no other source of deco gas, not enough back gas left to complete a deco on the longer schedule, and no buddy in sight.) In that situation I'd much rather have a piston reg than a diaphragm reg as the odds are much better that the piston reg will actually work and clear itself when attached to the remaining deco bottle.

 

[RTodd]

On deco/stage gear, if you pressurize bottles before dive, then turn off valve but don't purge them you shouldn't have a flooding problem whether diaphragm or piston. Common sense to me but correct me if I am wrong on this.

Regs getting purged is one way particularly when carrying multiple bottles on scooters. The other is stages being left in a high flow section of cave.

 

[matt_unique]

On deco/stage gear, if you pressurize bottles before dive, then turn off valve but don't purge them you shouldn't have a flooding problem whether diaphragm or piston. Common sense to me but correct me if I am wrong on this.

This is a thread about SP and Apex but if you had a Sherwood reg on your deco bottle for example you would need to leave it pressurized the entire dive. Though the 1st stage has a "one way" bleed valve I would not trust that under great pressure. I use a Sherwood for deco and leave it on the entire time.

--Matt

 

[Hop Devil]

Apexs Regs: I have the ATX50. Performs very well, very reliable. The service isn't
inexpensive however. I just had mine rebuilt. The cost was $96.00. Thiry six of that
was for the rebuilt kit. I sent in a Sherwood Oasis at the same time and the rebuild
on that was $45. total. I don't know what Scubapro charges but you may want to
way the cost of long term maintenance.

 

[Michael Freeman]

scubapro parts are free as long as you buy from one of their dealers and you have it serviced each year. I even get free batteries in my uwatec computer.

You still have to pay for service but the parts are free from my understanding.