Another "buying my first regulator" thread

[northernone]

I have found that breathing requires a lot more effort and can become uncomfortable when I get to about 90 feet or so, to the point that it discourages me from doing deeper dives. If possible, I would like to find a regulator that can mitigate that effect.

To be frank, I believe you will find this to be a diving technique problem that can not be solved with equipment. Unless you have only dove badly tuned and unusually poor quality regs I would be shocked to hear back you find a regulator that addresses the issue you're having. CO2 retention from unsuitable breathing patterns and general narcosis are likely causes for the issue you're having. That shallow, fluidics and the gas density of air is unlikely to be a significant factor. I don't know your physical conditioning but it often is a factor as well.

I can't be much help, at 90 ft I've never experienced a functional decent reg that wouldn't provide comfortable air flow, nor any that even particularly shine, at that shallow depth with suitable breathing technique.

My advice would be to try a few regs, see which one you like and feel provides you the kind of breathing you enjoy and then purchase that one. Comfort with our equipment choices is important for mental peace at depth which in turn controls our breathing.

Some regs require more effort to "get them started" but in the end provide more air. Others, breathe easier, but have less air flow. etc. etc. Mainly depending upon tuning rather then design when we're talking about 90ft down.

You've had one of the living resources @couv reply in this thread. I'm just a guy who loves diving and tinkering with equipment, I've only had 27 different borrowed regs past 90ft so far. I enjoy trying gear, it's a great byproduct of diving.


Regards,
Cameron

 

[scubadada]

Hi @northernone

I still occasionally dive my MK5/R109 purchased in 1972, it performs admirably

 

[Ironborn]

To be frank, I believe you will find this to be a diving technique problem that can not be solved with equipment. Unless you have only dove badly tuned and unusually poor quality regs I would be shocked to hear back you find a regulator that addresses the issue you're having. CO2 retention from unsuitable breathing patterns and general narcosis are likely causes for the issue you're having. That shallow, fluidics and the gas density of air is unlikely to be a significant factor.

I can't be much help, at 90 ft I've never experienced a functional reg that wouldn't provide comfortable air flow nor any that even particularly shine at that shallow depth.

My advice would be to try a few regs, see which one you like and feel provides you the kind of breathing you enjoy and then purchase that one. Comfort with our equipment choices is important for mental peace at depth which in turn controls our breathing.

Some regs require more effort to "get them started" but in the end provide more air. Others, breathe easier, but have less air flow. etc. etc. Mainly depending upon tuning rather then design when we're talking about 90ft down.

You've had one of the living resources @couv reply in this thread. I'm just a guy who loves diving and tinkering with equipment.

I'm in the process of buying a d300 for some deeper diving I do. Have enjoyed a 109s and a legend as being nice at giving me air at depth already. My go to reg for diving deep, deeper then I'd like to post on a public forum, is the Conshelf, a relative of the Titan and they do quite well.

Regards,
Cameron

I have only used rental regs thus far and thus have no idea how well-maintained they were, so perhaps that was a factor. Hence my interest in completing my own gear collection.

It did occur to me that narcosis might be a factor, but I did not feel any other narcosis symptoms.

Would gas density make a difference if I was on Nitrox, rather than air? Wouldn't the higher levels of oxygen make Nitrox a bit denser than regular air, since oxygen is denser?

 

[northernone]

Hi @northernone

I still occasionally dive my MK5/R109 purchased in 1972, it performs admirably

Tidy bit of kit aren't they!

 

[northernone]

I have only used rental regs thus far and thus have no idea how well-maintained they were, so perhaps that was a factor. Hence my interest in completing my own gear collection.

It did occur to me that narcosis might be a factor, but I did not feel any other narcosis symptoms.

Would gas density make a difference if I was on Nitrox, rather than air? Wouldn't the higher levels of oxygen make Nitrox a bit denser than regular air, since oxygen is denser?

Having your own equipment is really helpful! Some rental gear can be in bad shape.

Self evaluation for narcosis is difficult and nearly impossible early on. Feelings of unable to get sufficient air, or being fixated on the effort of breathing can be a sign. More likely due to CO2 buildup from shallow breathing or unsuitable patterns.

Gas density becomes an issue deeper, in technical diving Trimix is helpful for greater depths, adding less dense helium to the breathing gas.

 

[Couv]

Thank you for the feedback. What are the pros and cons of balanced vs. unbalanced second stages, if ease of breathing at greater depth is not one of them?

Are you (or is anyone else) familiar with the Aqualung Titan? That was my second choice.

I'm not familiar with the Titan.

Balanced vs. Unbalanced Second Stages:

When a second stage is mated with a balanced first stage it makes very little difference in performance with either a balanced or unbalanced second stage. Performance-wise, the advantage of a balanced second stage is realized when it is mated with an unbalanced first stage. (MK 2/3/200) The balanced second can compensate somewhat for the lower IP an unbalanced first stage will deliver at lower tank pressures.

Performance aside, here are some of the pluses and minuses of each.

Balanced second stage
Holds tune longer.
Can accommodate a wider variety of intermediate pressures.
The seat last longer (due to a lighter spring pressure when not in use.)

Unbalanced second stage
Seats are less expensive and can be flipped over and used on both sides.
Fewer o-rings makes for a (marginally) cheaper service.

 

[ams511]

I'm not familiar with the Titan.

The Titan is an unbalanced second stage with a balanced first stage. NESS and Divers Supply and maybe some others have them on clearance.

 

[Still Kicking]

Regarding the Micron (and the Micra before it), does a smaller second stage require the reg to be more sensitive (which in real-world terms makes it more "finicky")?

I assume that this is the case, due to the shorter travel of the lever and the smaller surface area of the diaphragm but I'm hoping to get some confirmation of my perception on this. TIA

 

[buddhasummer]

Regarding the Micron (and the Micra before it), does a smaller second stage require the reg to be more sensitive (which in real-world terms makes it more "finicky")?

I assume that this is the case, due to the shorter travel of the lever and the smaller surface area of the diaphragm but I'm hoping to get some confirmation of my perception on this. TIA

Can't speak to your exact question but I owned a Micra ADJ for some years and never had a problem with it.

 

[Still Kicking]

Can't speak to your exact question but I owned a Micra ADJ for some years and never had a problem with it.

Maybe it's just that I'm biased because the Micra ADJ is a PITA to work on