An Idea Taken From DIR

[Blitz]

I use bungee, it isn't that hard to pull on and I leave short little tails after the knots so that I can grab them easier when I stow the hose. The configuration that you are talking about isn't so much DIR as it is a technical styling. (not to say that the GUE divers don't use them)

 

[Nemrod]

Quote:

"I would think there would be a better disconnect system, then to have to pull it from the grasp of two inner tubes?"


Well, it works really good. One quick yank and the hose and regulator are deployed. It takes about .2 seconds to go from stowed to in my mouth, left hand, and about hardly another second to get the valve turning on with my right.

Practicing different ideas in the pool is a good idea and a worthwhile use of time, I do it in the pool first as well.


I have never been so stressed I needed air NOW or I would die. I think you should practice all of this for full pool dives with no mask---dive without a mask for entire tank. Doff and Dons are good confidence builders.
N

 

[ShallowDiverDave]

I think the yanking on the hose was one of the things that bothered me in the first place, but maybe it's not a big deal.

I didn't just come up with my idea because I wanted to be different...I had what I thought were legitimate concerns about the "standard" pony slung system.

 

[ShallowDiverDave]

Again, and I'm not trying to change anyone's mind, because I don't think that's going to happen, most of you are more experienced than I, I will post a picture the next time I'm home, and you can specifically critique it.

 

[ClevelandDiver]

Great post, it's hard to beat experience. I'm not currently "solo diving", however, I am preparing to become a solo diver, by getting my gear together and practicing in the pool . No one has it perfect the first time, I have a lot to learn.

My thought is, ultimately, time can be the difference between life and death. In other words, given a specific OOA, you may have at the most, X seconds before your body must satisfy the urge to breathe, whether it's water or the air in your tank, your body will attempt to breathe. I don't want to purposely eliminate any of those X seconds if my life might depend on it.

What if your buddy had knocked your reg out on an inhale, ut oh, you just inhaled water and are choking violently...would you rather reach to your necklace or deploy the system (turn on valve, remove reg)?

It definitely was not my buddy who knocked out my reg. It was some clown who had no business doing an 80 foot dive. And I did start to inhale the water, but my brain somehow knew it was not a good thing to a lungfull (I think I did suck down a little). I even spit it out and went to inhale again as the mouthpiece was still in place and I had not yet realized the second stage was disconnected.

Months earlier my buddy had a similiar problem when switching to a stage bottle. The exhaust valve on his second stage had folded over on itself and therefore flooded the second stage. As soon as he took his finger off the purge button it would fill up again. At the time he did not know what had happened, he just knew every time he tried to breathe he kept getting water. After several attempts to get air from the stage bottle, he switched back to his primary reg. His problem lasted longer than my 10 second problem, but he did not panick as he knew he still had a lot of air in his other tank. When he told me what had happened, I was impressed that he handled it so well and did not panick in the slightest.

A few months later I had my incident and was suprised at what a non-event it was and quickly my body knew to not breathe in the water that had somehow replaced my air. If it had not happened to me personally, I would have assumed that a lungfull of water was inevitable in such a situation.

Also, you are breathing air at pressures 2-5 times that the at the surface. That extra ppo2 seems to allow your body to go a little longer without a breath than you might think.

And to answer your question, yes I would prefer to grab a bungied second stage to my primary air source. But I would not want my slung/moveable bottle to be attached to something around my neck.

 

[Nemrod]

"Yank"

does not mean to pull it so hard that you tear the hose off. Your questions reflect that you have never done any of this in actuallity which is normal. Once you do you will see it does not involve hose tearing forces--lol--assuming you have things set up correctly or even close.

N

 

[ShallowDiverDave]

It definitely was not my buddy who knocked out my reg. It was some clown who had no business doing an 80 foot dive. And I did start to inhale the water, but my brain somehow knew it was not a good thing to a lungfull (I think I did suck down a little). I even spit it out and went to inhale again as the mouthpiece was still in place and I had not yet realized the second stage was disconnected.

Months earlier my buddy had a similiar problem when switching to a stage bottle. The exhaust valve on his second stage had folded over on itself and therefore flooded the second stage. As soon as he took his finger off the purge button it would fill up again. At the time he did not know what had happened, he just knew every time he tried to breathe he kept getting water. After several attempts to get air from the stage bottle, he switched back to his primary reg. His problem lasted longer than my 10 second problem, but he did not panick as he knew he still had a lot of air in his other tank. When he told me what had happened, I was impressed that he handled it so well and did not panick in the slightest.

A few months later I had my incident and was suprised at what a non-event it was and quickly my body knew to not breathe in the water that had somehow replaced my air. If it had not happened to me personally, I would have assumed that a lungfull of water was inevitable in such a situation.

Also, you are breathing air at pressures 2-5 times that the at the surface. That extra ppo2 seems to allow your body to go a little longer without a breath than you might think.

And to answer your question, yes I would prefer to grab a bungied second stage to my primary air source. But I would not want my slung/moveable bottle to be attached to something around my neck.

I see, good points.

Back when I naively had a 6 cu ft redundant, I attempted to test it out in shallow water, when I went back to my primary it kept breathing wet, even after purging it numerous times as you speak of, I very calmly stayed on the 6 for a minute or two until I finally got the primary working. I prepared myself to ascend if the 6 got too low, but I was only in 15 ft. of water, and I fixed the problem anyway, then ascended.

 

[ShallowDiverDave]

"Yank"

does not mean to pull it so hard that you tear the hose off. Your questions reflect that you have never done any of this in actuallity which is normal. Once you do you will see it does not involve hose tearing forces--lol--assuming you have things set up correctly or even close.

N

You are correct my friend. You remember the picture I posted of how I wished I could position the bottle? Well, yesterday when I tried the standard positioning first (chest to hip) I loved it, I never even tried my silly idea. I'm converging. Maybe I need to experience the same thing with the hose and reg, we will see.

 

[SDAnderson]

Let me pose this question, for those solo divers who have there redundant air rig in the same fashion that DIR divers sling stage bottles, how is the hose and reg attached to the bottle. Do you use some type of inner tube or rubber tubing that seems to be standard? If so, how forcefully must you pull on the hose to remove it from the bottle? I would think there would be a better disconnect system, then to have to pull it from the grasp of two inner tubes?

When solo diving, I prefer doubles to a single tank with a sling bottle. Better control, better redundancy, etc. That said, I don't have a real problem with the idea of a sling bottle for those who don't have/like doubles. We're all going to die and if you're number comes up while you are diving solo, a 40cf sling bottle isn't likely to be the cause.

The best ideas often being stolen, I've borrowed liberally from what has come to be known as the DIR stage rigging protocol. The second stage hose is held in a single loop along the side of the bottle by a couple of 1/4" bungee cords or heavy elastic or rubber crab bands. The second stage is parked next to the valve and held in place with a small loop of bungee, it deploys with a gentle pull - if it's difficult to pull free you need looser or longer bungee loops, etc. The system is simple, proven and mostly works. I have experienced a couple of problems with this system that warranted minor adjustments:

• it can be hard to restow the second stage and hose if you are wearing heavy gloves unless you attach some kind of pull to the retaining bands, making them easier to lift up, and;
• to answer my own questions about charging the system, I've had problems in cold water with the system discharging, resulting in the second stage valve flooding with water. When recharged and used, the combination of very cold air and very cold water can result in ice and that's a baaad thing. At best, you get a mouthful of high velocity (and razor sharp) icicles, at worst, you also have a freeze related free flow that means you're going to have to feather your valve for the rest of your dive. To my mind, it's worth the risk of losing a little gas (get a bigger tank, if you need to) in cold water by keeping the valve cracked in order to avoid the freeze problem.

One final piece of advice - solo diving is no place to be learning about anything. If it was as easy as it sounds, you wouldn't need to ask so many questions, would you? At the risk of sounding like a hectoring nanny, until you learn how to assemble, deploy and use a reliable redundant air supply, I hope you will stick to diving with a buddy.

 

[ShallowDiverDave]

One final piece of advice - solo diving is no place to be learning about anything. If it was as easy as it sounds, you wouldn't need to ask so many questions, would you? At the risk of sounding like a hectoring nanny, until you learn how to assemble, deploy and use a reliable redundant air supply, I hope you will stick to diving with a buddy.

At the risk of repeating myself, great post pal. As far as this quote goes, there are over 30 pages of discussion whether I should be solo diving or not at this point. I agreed with experienced divers and am postponing it. I am currently taking a number of advanced courses with some very knowledgeable instructors and will have many more dives before soloing myself. Will this be enough to fully equip me to solo dive? Hell no, it's not cut and dry. Ultimately it's up to the individual, not a certain number of dives or a certain certification level, to understand and fully grasp what it takes to solo dive safely .

However, I am gradually getting my gear configured for solo diving, and testing it in the pool. While I do understand the points most of you have made regarding the positioning of the reg and hose and it being on or off, I still don't see much of a problem with my idea. If the reg around my neck causes some ridiculous freeflow, then I would abort the dive with my back gas. If I'm entangled beyond recovery, give me a darwin award.

No it's not that simple, but, I like the idea of knowing my redundant system is on and practically slapping me in the face. I like this solution to a problem with my back gas. This is of great importance to me. Sorry, I'm not so sure my mind can be changed on this because I still don't consider it a big deal, especially in the very benign diving that I want to do.