Air management for beginner.

[Blackwood]

Since when does any agency owe us everything? Take what they offer, and learn the rest somewhere else.

They don't owe you a thing... until you pay for their services.

In describing its curriculum, PADI (for example) states as the first point:

http://www.padi.com/padi/en/sd/whatsinvolved.aspx
Knowledge Development – This develops your familiarity with basic principles and procedures. You learn things like how pressure affects your body, how to choose the best gear and what to consider when planning dives.

Either they don't think "do I have adequate gas" is a necessary consideration (reckless) or they aren't delivering what they owe.

 

[daniel f aleman]

What Peter Guy said, ten times over.

 

[Blackwood]

What Peter Guy said, ten times over.

While I agree with some of what he said (e.g. ratio deco - though better and simpler than buhlmann deco tables, IMO - may not be specifically necessary), I can't agree that gas management is knowledge overload for anyone who can perform the most basic arithmetic.

 

[ClayJar]

Most of the recreational divers I know would have nothing to do with gas management. They are more than happy to dive follow-the-leader dives, and they see no need to learn anything. I do not refuse to dive with them, however, I make it a point to go over a gas plan each time they dive with me. Gradually, they warm up to at least the *concept* of gas planning, even if not the arithmetic.

For a few of them, being exposed to gas planning opens their eyes, and soon enough, they're actually doing their own gas planning (for fun, even!). A few of them decide to despise gas planning and have nothing more to do with it. The rest, who form the majority around me, will likely never work up their own gas plan, but once their eyes have been opened to the dangers their lack of knowledge exposes them to, they are more than happy to dive with logical gas plans -- they just have to get them from somewhere.

Computers that provide gas consumption estimates are nice, and rule-of-thumb tables are great, too. I even printed up some dogtag-size ascend-by-X-psi charts, laminated them, and hand them out to people who listen to my gas planning talk and decide they want something better than "ascend at X" or "be back with Y". For an occasional diver strapped to an AL80, that small amount of knowledge is enough to help knock them out of the OOA-candidate group.

Personally, I find it inexcusable when I encounter a DM/instructor who can't calculate gas management, but while a purely recreational diver would certainly benefit from the knowledge of how to run gas management numbers, using pre-calculated tables is perfectly reasonable for them. (They should just teach two sets of tables: dive tables to prevent DCS and gas consumption tables to prevent OOA.)

 

[snepdiver]

Personally, I find it inexcusable when I encounter a DM/instructor who can't calculate gas management, but while a purely recreational diver would certainly benefit from the knowledge of how to run gas management numbers, using pre-calculated tables is perfectly reasonable for them. (They should just teach two sets of tables: dive tables to prevent DCS and gas consumption tables to prevent OOA.)

I agree. More gas management in basic OW would be nice.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Most of the recreational divers I know would have nothing to do with gas management.

Considering the number of ScubaBoard members ... from Instructor to not-yet-certified ... who have contacted me requesting the gas management handout I use with my seminar, I would have to disagree with this statement.

So far, I think I've e-mailed this handout to well over 300 people, just from this board.

Locally I've given the seminar four times within a fairly small geographical range (south Puget Sound) since January, and had reasonably good turnout each time.

That tells me that there's a pretty fair percentage of people who want to know what it's about ... once they are aware that there's some knowledge to be gained.

The biggest problem I see is that the majority of recreational divers are being told by their instructors during their initial training that they don't need to know this stuff, and since they don't know any better they take the instructor's word for it.

but while a purely recreational diver would certainly benefit from the knowledge of how to run gas management numbers, using pre-calculated tables is perfectly reasonable for them. (They should just teach two sets of tables: dive tables to prevent DCS and gas consumption tables to prevent OOA.)

That IS a neat idea ... the most important thing a new diver can take away from it would be simply the concept that dive planning includes making sure you have adequate gas to do the dive you're planning. Once you've established the mindset, the knowledge base will grow as the diver's skills do.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[daniel f aleman]

The point is: information is out there. Thank you Bob, lamont, et al. PADI and the other agencies do what they do, no point arguing their methods. Now, part of what makes NAUI OW and AOW programs more detailed than that of PADI, is that NAUI Instructors can offer students (who are interested and capable) a tailored program, which can include gas management.

Feel free to choose your certification agency wisely...

 

[ArcticDiver]

A diver has to know how to dive without running out of air. Period. To send a student out into the world without teaching them that is irresponsible. I don't want part of their experience to be running OOA. The numbers are easy to learn without having to master gas management from first principles.

Many thousands of dives where no one runs out of gas are accomplished every year without knowing the gas management calculations that are being discussed in this thread. From that I would argue that these divers do know how to dive without running out of air. They just don't do it as elegantly as some.

There are a variety of methods to accomplish this. There is the rule of thirds I was taught. There is the guidance of a professional who accompanies the diver and who essentially does the gas management for the diver. That has been talked about by several posters in this thread. There is the use of an air integrated computer that tells the diver the status of their gas supply.

My point is that the beginning diver doesn't have the data to do a good job of gas management according to the methods more advanced people use. Certainly they could use some really, really conservative numbers to do the planning. But, that is not realistic since that method would result in very short dives compared to others they are diving with. Peer pressure and the dive master/guide reaction will put a lot of pressure on the diver to do it differently.

Those too short dives will cause the new diver to figuratively throw the baby out with the bath water. Especially since most divers I'm told dive maybe once or twice a year while on vacation.

Give the new diver a rule of thumb they can use or an air integrated computer. Then as they get the data they need to do the elegant gas management this thread contemplates teach them how. But always remember that the 10 dive a year diver, which is most divers I'm told, is not exactly in the same category as most posting to this thread.

Now to read the rest of the posts.

 

[jeckyll]

The point is: information is out there. Thank you Bob, lamont, et al. PADI and the other agencies do what they do, no point arguing their methods. ...
Feel free to choose your certification agency wisely...

Daniel, I think that there is a point in arguing about their methods to the point of educating divers what is missing. The problem is that many people "Don't know what they don't know".

Perhaps if enough people ask the questions someone at PADI may actually listen (I know it's doubtful!).

I do think it is great that we have people who have put in the time and effort to create some useful gas management information and have made it available "to the masses"

 

[Carribeandiver]

Gas management for OW Divers:

"Be on the boat with 500psi"

Class concluded.

yep, checked my notes, that was it verbatum.