Accident at Vortex Springs 8-20-10

[Dive-aholic]

First, although he may be from out of state, the diver was living and working in the Florida panhandle.

Second, the gate is not your typical fence gate. It is a welded rebar grate with a square opening in the middle and another welded rebar grate that fits over that square. It was chained in place and padlocked. It's a keeping the honest people honest type of thing.

 

[Dive-aholic]

I added this recap to the first post for quick reference. If I missed anything, let me know. I'll update as more info becomes available

He was a dive con working on assistant instructor. He may have gotten his assistant instructor rating and maybe even his instructor rating, but either one would be no more than one month old.

 

[tstormdiver]

He was a dive con working on assistant instructor. He may have gotten his assistant instructor rating and maybe even his instructor rating, but either one would be no more than one month old.

Rob,... not trying to be critical, but by SSI, a Dive Control Specialist (Dive Con) is a combination of Dive Master & Assistant Instructor.

 

[tracydr]

I agree that it's not our responsibility, or the cave diving community's responsibility to protect the public from poor judgement.
I do wish, though that we would give a little more "why" to divers in open water class when they are told not to penetrate a cave, wreck or go deep without training. Honestly, until I read Shadow Divers and had some experience I really didn't appreciate the dangers of the sport. I could see a young or foolhardy person penetrating a cave just because PADI told him not to.
I've felt for a long time that "The Last Dive" and "Shadow Divers" should be mandatory OWC scare reading.

 

[sabbath999]

You have an outdated manual. NSS-CDS standards have been 200 linear feet and 100 feet in depth for quite some time now.

Good to know. Thanks.

 

[tstormdiver]

had some experience I really didn't appreciate the dangers of the sport.

I think this could be true in many situations. I am guilty of the same & in 1 case was very lucky. I would guess there are many others who have also made poor choices based on what you just wrote.

 

[Hetland]

Ok....I ay the following now to point fingers, but in situations like this everyone must consider their own potential role in the result. Follow my thought process. An out of state, non-cave certified diver manipulates the gate open to gain access to an area he should not be in. He does this not by chance....but because he has evidently done this before. Certainly he is not the only one. Does Vortex have knowledge that this has taken place in the past? If so, should there have been an effort to install a better gate system? And before you flame me and say Votex is not responsbile for the actions and poor decisions of others....( which is in part true...)....when they assume a certain level of responsibility to protect people from such poor decisions ( ie...putting a gate up in the first place) shouldn't they make sure they fulfill that responsibility appropriately? I mean.....otherwise....why have the gate up in the first place?

Just thinking out loud.....but I hate hearing that compromising this gate has happened in the past by this diver....because unless he is some master underwater locksmith....someone else out there i doing the same stupid thing. There should be a gate on that gave that insures ONLY cave certified divers can access the cave......which means I will never be in that sucker.

Out of state is irrelevant. If you want non-Floridians to stay out of the state, you will need to institute a state income tax (a pretty big one too).

It takes a second-grade education to pick most consumer-grade padlocks. I've never tried to pick one underwater, but I don't see any reason why it would be any harder (the cylinder might be harder to turn). Any gate can be compromised. The flip side of a gate is that someone could accidentally become locked in. You would also be unwise to lock the gate closed behind you, which means divers can follow you in.

Short of collapsing the cave with explosives, people will get in no matter what actions you take..... In fact, I'd bet folks will be digging past the obstruction caused by the explosion in no time.

 

[Kicker1866]

Dive-Aholic....I think I understand the message you are sending and if that is the case the Yes, I agree.....if someone is so motivated to break the rules and go where they are not supposed to go that they will be dishonest to gain access to that place....well there is not much a well regulated business can do to stope them. It i kinda like a Charter boat Captain checking C-card and Log books.....well if those are good checks and balances for safety but they asume the individual presenting the information is being honest.

I am followed thi thread since the first post was made and have been in thought about this ever since I learned about it. I was trained in Vortex and am taking my girlfriend there labor day to get her BOW. I have been diving only a year and have my AOW. I am the poster child for safe diving and following every rule taught. I love the sport and appreciate the spiritaul place that a great dive can take you.

I have marveled at the Majesty of the Oriskany and seen the shadow of her officers as I did a swim thru on the Flight Bridge....I have following one single Angel fish and lived 10 minutes of her life with her....I have drifted the beautiful reefs of Cozumel....and the list goes on and on. It is a list I will add to as long as God lets me. But smart diving, being humble, and safe are always paramount to these experiences.

I pack a small 13cf pony and read something on a recent "pony" thread that applies to me. I am paraphrasing, but.....I have a hot girlfriend....my kids make me happy....I love my career...I have LSU football season tickets....I have alot to live for. I cannot understand poor decisions...I do not understand solo diving or diving outside one's training....I just don't.

My heart breaks for the family...and for the friends who have posted....but the reality is that anyone who doe such things and doesn't think that they may place other at risk in coming to save them......well it is selfish....regardless if the person is a selfish person or not....it is just selfish.

I bet more than one of those rescure divers tinkered with how they could push farther than they may have been comfortable with to try to make thi recovery. It is their training that keeps them within their limits....the human nature is what would want them to go forward....and it is the human nature they have to live with if the recovery is not made...the "what if"..."did I do all I could". It is an unfair position to put everyone in.

Again...this thread is not one to persecute "B"...it is one to evalue action before an after...to look at EVERY consequence of this tragic situation that we as a dive community...Cave certified, BOW, AOW, or any other level of certification...may educate new divers, self-police, and maintain self-discipline within ourselves if faced with temptations.

I hope we are all troubled or angry or saddened or something other that casually curious....that is the only way we as a community can use this to minimize the potential for this to happen again. My 7 yr old is already in the pool learnng to breath on a regulator. He cannot wait to get certified in 3 years. He learn things even now. We take time to learn about equipment and gas laws ( Yes...I know, but he is very smart).

Tonight...I sat him down and we talked about this. I explained how this was what happened when you did not follow the rules and did not get trained correctly and simply thought you knew something because you watched someone else.

This has been very troubling and frankly....I just do not know what else to do with it.

 

[Meister481]

"I have been diving only a year and have my AOW. I am the poster child for safe diving and following every rule taught."

Rule.. No overhead unless trained.

"I have marveled at the Majesty of the Oriskany and seen the shadow of her officers as I did a swim thru on the Flight Bridge..."

Rule.... Must be 8 to enter Bubblemaker class. Class must be taught by a professional in good standing.
"My 7 yr old is already in the pool learnng to breath on a regulator. He cannot wait to get certified in 3 years."

"may educate new divers, self-police, and maintain self-discipline within ourselves if faced with temptations."

I digress.

 

[Kicker1866]

Meister...geez...do I really gotta outline every detail of life to avoid critical analysis? LOL...On the "O" I was with an instructor was working with me for penetration dives. Honestly, I am not a fan.....

And who said anything about Bubblemakers? Gimme a break...I am gonna let my kid breath off my Spair Air bottle in a frickin swimming pool. None of us are driving instuctors, but we start teaching our kids to drive before they go to driver's ed and the state certifies them as license drivers.