nereas
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A one-time occurrence (note the proper spelling) deserves a one-time credit, even so.
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A question to an incident
- Thread starter Skeeter1097
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A one-time occurrence (note the proper spelling) deserves a one-time credit, even so.
piikki
Contributor
Yeah, I too would be pissed. There are all kinds of "what ifs" one can play and "how sorry would you be if that happened while you are pissed about missing a dive" but this sounds a bit thick.
How far were you from shore? How long (less 20 minutes) did they use to evaluate/monitor the girl's condition? In what condition was she when you (other divers) got up? Did the captain explain the risks of staying for the dive/s? Any apology at all that the day turned out the way it did? And did you ever ask whether the girl requested/demanded the return?
To me this sounds like a way too nervous captain to travel with. First of all, if he made the quick decision to call you all up from the first dive, well fine, maybe it all looked nasty at first or maybe the capt panicked a bit too. After that though, why such a rush - good capt should have seen some of this and if he was really worried he should have called for help/advice. (Makes you really suspect the motives of calling the day to be honest).
And a good business would really not be rubbing it in about tips when at the same time telling that there will be nothing done about all the lost dive time. That would have really gotten my neck hair up - even when I know it is NOT the DM:s fault (poor DM really earned his pay).
Sucky day.
How far were you from shore? How long (less 20 minutes) did they use to evaluate/monitor the girl's condition? In what condition was she when you (other divers) got up? Did the captain explain the risks of staying for the dive/s? Any apology at all that the day turned out the way it did? And did you ever ask whether the girl requested/demanded the return?
To me this sounds like a way too nervous captain to travel with. First of all, if he made the quick decision to call you all up from the first dive, well fine, maybe it all looked nasty at first or maybe the capt panicked a bit too. After that though, why such a rush - good capt should have seen some of this and if he was really worried he should have called for help/advice. (Makes you really suspect the motives of calling the day to be honest).
And a good business would really not be rubbing it in about tips when at the same time telling that there will be nothing done about all the lost dive time. That would have really gotten my neck hair up - even when I know it is NOT the DM:s fault (poor DM really earned his pay).
Sucky day.
hmmm. Interesting incident.
Let's break it down.
The Rescue: There is no right way or wrong way to do a rescue. She sounds like a very inexperienced diver (I am guessing not a student or the instructor would have checked the diver's equipment). If not a student, then the diver is accountable for her own equipment. The buddy would be the second level of accountability in which he failed. The DM saw the panick and got the diver to the surface as safely as possible. Kudos to the DM. Diver and buddy should seek retraining or turn in their ccard. Sounds like the diver will probably never dive again, anyway.
Post Rescue: The diver is back on the boat and physically OK. Obviously very emotionally shaken. In any event, there was a rescue on the captain's boat -- albeit not an emergency. Let's think about what the captain was thinking -- assuming he didn't want to watch he afternoon football game. If this episode escalates into DCS or some other shock or trauma, I have to react quickly and we go from a non-emergency to an emergency. Or, I can let everyone dive and hope it does not escalate. Once they are off my boat, they aren't my problem. I think I will error on the side of conservative and get them back while there is no emergency. The captain knows full well that there is a possibility of physiological trauma that could be delayed. This woman who aspirated water should go to the Urgent Care nonetheless. I have a tough time faulting the captain on this one. Because, what if something did occur 20 minutes or 30 minutes down the road. Time is everything in an emergency. I am not going to say this was the wrong call. However, as a diver, I can empathize why you feel the way you do.
Post Return: The crew may not have the authority to give away credit. However, the captain should have informed the shop of the incident. In which case, the shop should have contacted all the clients and offered them some sort of explanation and reonciliation - such as a full credit. Bad crisis management is a great way to lose repeat customers. Additionally, the family in which this incident surrounds should have been a lot more gracious than it sounds.
They say there is no such thing as a bad day of diving. That's arguable. I will say, this day could have been a lot worse. Again, Kudos to the DM ... no matter what he did or didn't do, the end result is a diver who could have died and came out of it alive and well.
jcf
////
Let's break it down.
The Rescue: There is no right way or wrong way to do a rescue. She sounds like a very inexperienced diver (I am guessing not a student or the instructor would have checked the diver's equipment). If not a student, then the diver is accountable for her own equipment. The buddy would be the second level of accountability in which he failed. The DM saw the panick and got the diver to the surface as safely as possible. Kudos to the DM. Diver and buddy should seek retraining or turn in their ccard. Sounds like the diver will probably never dive again, anyway.
Post Rescue: The diver is back on the boat and physically OK. Obviously very emotionally shaken. In any event, there was a rescue on the captain's boat -- albeit not an emergency. Let's think about what the captain was thinking -- assuming he didn't want to watch he afternoon football game. If this episode escalates into DCS or some other shock or trauma, I have to react quickly and we go from a non-emergency to an emergency. Or, I can let everyone dive and hope it does not escalate. Once they are off my boat, they aren't my problem. I think I will error on the side of conservative and get them back while there is no emergency. The captain knows full well that there is a possibility of physiological trauma that could be delayed. This woman who aspirated water should go to the Urgent Care nonetheless. I have a tough time faulting the captain on this one. Because, what if something did occur 20 minutes or 30 minutes down the road. Time is everything in an emergency. I am not going to say this was the wrong call. However, as a diver, I can empathize why you feel the way you do.
Post Return: The crew may not have the authority to give away credit. However, the captain should have informed the shop of the incident. In which case, the shop should have contacted all the clients and offered them some sort of explanation and reonciliation - such as a full credit. Bad crisis management is a great way to lose repeat customers. Additionally, the family in which this incident surrounds should have been a lot more gracious than it sounds.
They say there is no such thing as a bad day of diving. That's arguable. I will say, this day could have been a lot worse. Again, Kudos to the DM ... no matter what he did or didn't do, the end result is a diver who could have died and came out of it alive and well.
jcf
////
ScubaSteve
Wow.....what a DB
nereas
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While you did point out that I typed faster than I should have, you just looked like an :mooner:. Note the actual CORRECT spelling (and to those whom I have offended with my terrible spelling mistake I apologize)
Occurrence
Well, at least you learned one new word for the day. You're welcome.
LeadTurn_SD
Contributor
This is just a thought.
One possibility the captain may have been concerned about, and I think what nereas was thinking about when he mentioned pneumonia, and what scubajcf mentions as a post rescue concern, is secondary drowning. It can occur in victims who inhale water... they apparently do not have to have experience a near-drowning as I once thought was the case.
Water, regardless of its salt content, can damage the inside surface of the lung, collapse the alveoli and cause pulmonary edema with a reduced ability to exchange air. This may cause death up to 72 hours after a near drowning incident.
I read a very recent case of a boy who was found dead several hours after going to a public swimming pool. He did not have a near-drowning incident at the pool, he was however playing with his friends, inhaled some water, coughed it out, did not feel well and went home. He told he mom he felt tired, went to take a nap, and the mother found him dead several hours later. Autopsy confirmed secondary drowning.
So it is possible the captain was trying to be very cautious, but some of the other things the OP posted seem to contradict this, so who knows.
One possibility the captain may have been concerned about, and I think what nereas was thinking about when he mentioned pneumonia, and what scubajcf mentions as a post rescue concern, is secondary drowning. It can occur in victims who inhale water... they apparently do not have to have experience a near-drowning as I once thought was the case.
Water, regardless of its salt content, can damage the inside surface of the lung, collapse the alveoli and cause pulmonary edema with a reduced ability to exchange air. This may cause death up to 72 hours after a near drowning incident.
I read a very recent case of a boy who was found dead several hours after going to a public swimming pool. He did not have a near-drowning incident at the pool, he was however playing with his friends, inhaled some water, coughed it out, did not feel well and went home. He told he mom he felt tired, went to take a nap, and the mother found him dead several hours later. Autopsy confirmed secondary drowning.
So it is possible the captain was trying to be very cautious, but some of the other things the OP posted seem to contradict this, so who knows.
nereas
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Seriously? This I have never heard. I suppose I have learned something today.
You learned 3 things.
About pneumonia.
About edema.
And how to spell.
divestoclimb
Contributor
If the captain was worried about this (and I can understand how he would be) he should have radioed for help to have EMS waiting on the dock.
If I were in this situation I would probably be unsure of what to do, so I think I would get on the radio, ask for advice from Coast Guard and then do whatever they say (which might be to head back). If he had done that, though, an ambulance should have been waiting.
divestoclimb
Contributor
[sorry I can't resist, this is not the first one of these I've read lately]
Do divers not know how to orally inflate a BC anymore???? What is going on with divers panicking or dieing because of one little button not working!?
exactly...or even better yet, if you still have your wits about you, reconnect the hose like you did while sitting on the bottom of the pool in class.
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