2 more upper keys dive fatalities, 8/6/2011

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THats awful. It really makes me believe the guy was severely over weighted though. Im not very experienced, but experienced enough to know that my bc typically has no air in it once submerged and surfacing isnt the least bit difficult.

Its hard to imagine how the guy was so over weighted that he sunk
 
Here's a possibility that occurs to me. If you had one of these

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AND it was disconnected...........

DC
 
Its hard to imagine how the guy was so over weighted that he sunk
Confusion on weighting is all too easy. Switch freshwater to ocean: add 4 pounds? Diving in swim suit & T instead of 7 mil: subtract 10 pounds? Buy a new BC: add 4 pounds? Rent a steel tank: subtract how much? Where were we? Make first dive, have problems getting down, decide to add weight, someone passes you some unmarked lead squares, doesn't seem right, trade out 2 large ones for 4 smaller ones with someone, lose track completely. :idk:

There is a right way to do it of course.
 
Confusion on weighting is all too easy. Switch freshwater to ocean: add 4 pounds? Diving in swim suit & T instead of 7 mil: subtract 10 pounds? Buy a new BC: add 4 pounds? Rent a steel tank: subtract how much? Where were we? Make first dive, have problems getting down, decide to add weight, someone passes you some unmarked lead squares, doesn't seem right, trade out 2 large ones for 4 smaller ones with someone, lose track completely. :idk:

There is a right way to do it of course.

I agree with Don's statement above....I've seen this scenario happen a ton of times on charters. It's happened to me also in Coz.
 
From this morning's local newspaper;
Kevin Moss: Was Parkinson's disease a factor in fatal dive? - South Florida Sun-Sentinel.com

Parkinson's did not define dead diver, family says


BOCA RATON—
Though he had tremors from an early stage case of Parkinson's disease, Kevin Moss was hardly disabled.
The 42-year-old systems analyst from Boca Raton worked out daily at a gym, parachuted from airplanes and enthusiastically pursued his true passion, scuba diving.

Exactly what happened 45 feet below the surface of the ocean off Plantation Key during a lobster hunt Saturday afternoon may never be known. But Moss and a diving companion, Judy Boone, 53, of Wellington, died after apparently running out of air as they fought to get to the surface, according to the Monroe County Sheriff's Office.
According to medical experts, a Parkinson's diagnosis is not a directive to give up physical activities. University of Miami movement disorder specialist Cenk Sengun said that for patients in the early stages of the disease, "There are no restrictions."
"Some patients are diagnosed with mild tremors, some stiffness, but are otherwise fully functional," said Sengun.
In advanced cases, however, heart function, blood pressure and even decision-making may be compromised, said Sungun. The pressure of being deep underwater can increase those risks, he added.
Moss's stepmother, Terrey Moss of Lighthouse Point, said Kevin Moss was diagnosed several years ago, and had developed a noticeable tremor.
But he was not impaired, she said. He had made over 400 dives, here and in Hawaii. He dove with Pavan in the Atlantic Ocean off Boca Raton as recently as Thursday to check out new equipment, she said.
Terrey Moss said her stepson also worked with the Michael J. Fox Foundation for Parkinson Research "to show that people with the disease can live a normal life."
She is confident that Parkinson's did not contribute to his death. "He was very fit," she said. "Nothing stood in his way."
Moss, Boone and three other friends from Palm Beach County were in the Florida Keys on what was to be a 54th birthday celebration for one of the five, Mariann Radwan of Highland Beach.
Radwan told investigators with the Monroe County Sheriff's Office that Moss ran into trouble, and she was sharing her air with him as they fought to drop his weights so they could rise to the surface.
Eventually, Radwan said, he pushed her away so that she could surface.
As she swam away, Radwan saw Boone trying to help Moss.
After Radwan returned to the dive boat, Capt. Dennis Leith of Tavernier said he searched for the lost divers for 15 minutes, then called the Coast Guard.
Also aboard the 25-foot Bayliner were Sherry Makis, 55, of Boca Raton, and Alan Boyd, 52, of Boynton Beach.
The search was called off about 8:30 p.m. Saturday. The bodies of Moss and Boone were found at around 9:30 a.m. on Sunday near the spot they were last seen.
The cause of death will be determined following autopsies.
"This is really shocking to me," Pavan said on Monday when he learned of Moss's death. "He was experienced, he had very good gear. He is not going to make a stupid mistake."
Born in Worthing, England, Moss moved to South Florida when he was about 18, according to Terrey Moss.
"He lived his life in a fun way, the best way he could," said Terrey Moss.
In addition to his stepmother and father, Peter, Moss leaves a daughter, four brothers and two sisters. Services are pending.
mwclary@tribune.com
Copyright © 2011, South Florida Sun-Sentinel
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. . . He had made over 400 dives, here and in Hawaii. He dove with Pavan in the Atlantic Ocean off Boca Raton as recently as Thursday to check out new equipment, she said.
. . . Radwan told investigators with the Monroe County Sheriff's Office that Moss ran into trouble, and she was sharing her air with him as they fought to drop his weights so they could rise to the surface.

I have been involved in SCUBA incident investigations.

My view is that, based on what we have read in this Forum, we do not fully know what happened. Hopefully, we will learn more.
 
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One thought on weighting.

Do we know what kind of gear Mr. Moss was wearing? That is, was he diving a recreational rig?

If Mr. Moss was diving with recreational gear, do we know if Mr. Moss was using a weight-integrated BCD or weight-belt?
 
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One thought on weighting.

Do we know what kind of gear Mr. Moss was wearing? That is, was he diving a recreational rig?

If Mr. Moss was diving with recreational gear, do we know if Mr. Moss was using a weight-integrated BCD or weight-belt?
It was mentioned somewhere here that he purchased the BC the day before.
He was wearing diving weights that were integrated into his diving gear and he couldn't figure out how to drop them, according to the sheriff's report...
 
One thought on weighting.

Do we know what kind of gear Mr. Moss was wearing? That is, was he diving a recreational rig?

If Mr. Moss was diving with recreational gear, do we know if Mr. Moss was using a weight-integrated BCD or weight-belt?


Since he purchased it the day before, likely it was the integrated weight variery.....although noone has said. Recreational is also a good assumption..... Not even tech divers go after lobster in 45' of water decked out in their tech gear. I don't.


This is one of those classic and tragic "chain of events" incidents. Begin with the fact that they were not using a flag/float while drift diving. Even if everything else had happened exactly the same, when the Capt went down looking for them he would have found them if they had a float.......

I was on the Spiegel and French that day and heard most of the exchange on the radio. From this and what I have since read, there are other open questions:

1. How can any experienced diver buy a new BC and not bother to figure out how to ditch weights?
2. Why did the first female that assisted not float them both to the surface using her BC (assuming she was not strong enough to swim them both up)? Was she wearing one of those dreadful "travel" BCs with next to no lift?
3. Why was the 2nd person that tried to assist not equipped with an octo?
4. Why did THIS person also not try to float them both?
5. Given the inability to ditch weights, why did he not ditch his entire kit and do a controlled ascent? After all, it was only 40-ish feet.
6. (Rhetorical question because this DOES happen) -- Barring equipment failure (none has been alleged here), how does ANYONE run out of air? Ever?


Hopefully we'll find some answers and learn something from this tragedy.... My sentiments go out to their families.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/teric/

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