BP/W banned in DM Course

[DevonDiver]

I don't share those thoughts. They can't be in a supervisory position until they have insurance, but demonstrating a skill is not a liability.

Unless, subsequently, the injured party made a legal claim on the basis that their misfortune resulted from incorrect tuition...

 

[hypertech]

Wait, I can make a claim based on incorrect tuition. I swear I must have paid too much for something!

 

[The Chairman]

Unless, subsequently, the injured party made a legal claim on the basis that their misfortune resulted from incorrect tuition...

No "unless". I simply disagree that this would be an issue in any litigation. Perhaps you could provide a suit where it was an issue.

• As an instructor, I am still in complete control of the class.
• It is up to me to point out any flaws in their presentation.
• It is up to me to be sure that the students perform the skill in the correct manner.
• Having someone else demonstrate a skill while I provide a running dialog can be useful if a student is missing a part of that skill.
• Having someone practice a skill to the point of presentation quality is a good thing.
• This practice is supported by the agencies I teach for.

 

[DBailey]

I don't share those thoughts. They can't be in a supervisory position until they have insurance, but demonstrating a skill is not a liability.

Once again, it comes down to the agency. PADI allows the AI to make skill demonstrations under the direct supervision of an Instructor, but not the DM, let alone a DMC.

And I do view a non-certified demonstrator as a liability. It is a matter of preference and point of view.

 

[The Chairman]

It is a matter of preference and point of view.

We're going to have to agree to agree on this. Of course, that was my point after all.

 

[knotical]

…PADI allows the AI to make skill demonstrations under the direct supervision of an Instructor, but not the DM, let alone a DMC. …

The PADI IM says the AI can conduct (page 40) or present (page 150) initial skills.
Such conducting or presenting can include using a DM (or DMC) as a training aid to demonstrate the skills. Otherwise why do we make sure DMCs can demonstrate?
We checked this several years ago with a PADI rep, and he agreed with our interpretation. An AI or higher does the talking and evaluating, but others can demonstrate.

 

[Peter Guy]

knotical -- Thank you for that interpretation -- I'm just going to accept it, otherwise, this would be another standards violation for me!

 

[SubMariner]

The PADI IM says the AI can conduct (page 40) or present (page 150) initial skills.
Such conducting or presenting can include using a DM (or DMC) as a training aid to demonstrate the skills. Otherwise why do we make sure DMCs can demonstrate?
We checked this several years ago with a PADI rep, and he agreed with our interpretation. An AI or higher does the talking and evaluating, but others can demonstrate.

Yup.

Also, who are you going to use when demonstrating skills that require TWO people, such as OOA, OOA Ascent, etc.? A student?

Thus, not only do they need to perform those skills well, they must be able to perform skills at DEMONSTRATION quality.

 

[Ste Wart]

Also, who are you going to use when demonstrating skills that require TWO people, such as OOA, OOA Ascent, etc.? A student?

Don't have much choice with a 1 on 1 course.

 

[DBailey]

The PADI IM says the AI can conduct (page 40) or present (page 150) initial skills.
Such conducting or presenting can include using a DM (or DMC) as a training aid to demonstrate the skills. Otherwise why do we make sure DMCs can demonstrate?
We checked this several years ago with a PADI rep, and he agreed with our interpretation. An AI or higher does the talking and evaluating, but others can demonstrate.

I'll admit that at this point we are talking about each person's understanding of how it is written in the IM.

Actually, I take that back. I see in the DM course, it mentions demonstrating skills. My bad.