I'm mad at Dive-aholic

[Jax]

Maybe the subject of this topic (Rob) would like to make a trip since it is close to his home............................Rob?

Super idea! CA is a lot closer than FL is . . .

 

[DaleC]

Fascinating discussion. I can't recall how many times I've gotten the old "sounds like an equipment solution to a skills problem" b_llsh_t when trying something different but I guess that's all changed now. Diving really is about having the freedom to try and do whatever makes you happy (huh). I'm still not entirely convinced though that backmounted twin tanks with an isolation manifold isn't the [-]only[/-] optimal configuration and that other non standardized configurations will make my diving more safe and FUN!

 

[ScubaFeenD]

SM is primarily a tool to get into nasty tight spots, where you often can't easily function as a good teammate. Those types of dives will forever be beyond "DIR".

I don't think GUE will ever embrace SM simply because old people have bad knees...

Kind of takes the "explorers" out of GUE, huh? Maybe rename it GU....Well I cant think of anything now.

I think there is no reason not to undertake incorporation of SM. I dont do it now, but I am interested, and a well tested, workable, standardized method would be intriguing.

Why, exactly, do you think the only reason to dive SM is because of old arthritic knees? Just because it works well for that affliction, doesn't mean that is the only reason it is good.

 

[ScubaFeenD]

Jax, Chris is right. GUE will not change or expand their procedures or equipment configuration to accomodate physical disability. I know this from a personal conversation with Bob Sherwood, who told me he would not accept a student into his Fundies classes, if that student required a release in the harness because of shoulder problems. It wasn't that he wouldn't pass them; he wouldn't teach them. Physical capacity is part of the GUE diving paradigm -- which is fine, and I'm not complaining about it. But the GUE answer to, "I can't carry doubles up and down the stairs any more" is not to do the dives that require you to carry them, and for me, that's not an option.

I see a lot of problems with any sidemount system becoming "DIR", beginning with the fact that they won't adopt one unless they are facing dives that they cannot accomplish with the existing equipment -- and such dives are, at least if you believe what the people who do them say, inherently poorly suited to a team approach, which is central to DIR diving. GUE certainly won't adopt a system just because some of their members want it, or because "everybody is doing it".

Sounds stubborn and last century. I think there is a serious difference between physical disability limiting your ability to dive, and allowing people to learn an alternative and equally valid way to dive. I mean, you have to ask the question of why they wont teach team sidemount, considering their ranks consist of such highly qualified instructors and divers. Why not respond to the memberships desire to learn more.

GUE is great, and I love learning the things that Wakulla divers have to share through the classes, but if they continue the "you dont need to know what we dont think you need to know" mentality they will lose a lot of ground eventually, and the steam they built up to revolutionize the dive industry might be lost.

 

[OneBrightGator]

Let's just hope if we see a GUE/UTD movement into sidemount we can get the benefits and keep the bullsnot out.

 

[HenrikBP]

Sounds stubborn and last century. I think there is a serious difference between physical disability limiting your ability to dive, and allowing people to learn an alternative and equally valid way to dive. I mean, you have to ask the question of why they wont teach team sidemount, considering their ranks consist of such highly qualified instructors and divers. Why not respond to the memberships desire to learn more.

As far as I've heard in personal conversations and read on SB (won't name names and can't find the thread, so you can discount this if you like) the Wakulla divers at times do deco in a side mount type set-up because it makes it easier to switch bottles for long deco hangs. I may be entirely wrong about this though ...

As for incorporating it into the GUE curriculum, I'm happy that GUE doesn't just jump on the "band wagon" when gear or practice becomes popular. It seems to me that the changes that *are* made - within the GUE system - come about after requests for change *as well as* careful consideration and extensive testing in order to make sure these changes are actual improvements. I personally see that as a good thing, while I understand that it may make the organization seem stagnant.

I would be very surprised if GUE were not looking into side mount options and how it might fit the system. But I don't see them including it in the curriculum and coming out with gear for it until they're absolutely certain it adds anything to what they already have and does so safely and in compliance with the system.

Henrik

 

[Scott L]

Sounds stubborn and last century. I think there is a serious difference between physical disability limiting your ability to dive, and allowing people to learn an alternative and equally valid way to dive. I mean, you have to ask the question of why they wont teach team sidemount, considering their ranks consist of such highly qualified instructors and divers. Why not respond to the memberships desire to learn more.

GUE is great, and I love learning the things that Wakulla divers have to share through the classes, but if they continue the "you dont need to know what we dont think you need to know" mentality they will lose a lot of ground eventually, and the steam they built up to revolutionize the dive industry might be lost.

They are numerous facets of scuba diving for which GUE does not provide training. SM diving is simply another entry added to the list. A good percentage of our area's experienced divers are spearfishman. They are among the world's best and most have never heard of GUE. Why are so many here demanding their involvement with the SM discipline?

TDI announced a few months ago that a different cylinder configuration does not change anything with regard to dive planning and execution. No one is jumping down their throats or IANTD's for their silence...

 

[Jax]

They are numerous facets of scuba diving for which GUE does not provide training. SM diving is simply another entry added to the list. A good percentage of our area's experienced divers are spearfishman. They are among the world's best and most have never heard of GUE. Why are so many here demanding their involvement with the SM discipline?

I don't think anyone is demanding anything, Scott; just a suggestion that those disciples of DIR who learn to appreciate sidemount could carry the water back to GUE.

 

[Kevin Carlisle]

I hope they don't embrace it. Let them keep diving the same old caves over and over.

 

[Jax]

:snicker: