Legality of "cave fills"

[Sea_Jay]

If you were (theoretically) working at a dive shop, and a customer came in & asked for a "cave fill" on LP steel tanks, and you filled them past their rated working pressure, are you breaking the law? The DOT regulates tanks so they would be the agency to deal with this. I am just curious if it is actually illegal to grossly overfill a cylinder.

 

[Wookie]

Depends on whether you think regulations have the force of law.

Would you be arrested and thrown in jail? No.

Would you be held criminally liable and subject to civil or criminal prosecution in the event of an accident regarding the overfiilled cylinder that was out of your control?

Absolutely.

 

[oya]

No.

You'd be breaking the law when you moved the over-pressurized cylinder.

 

[Capt Jim Wyatt]

Would you be held criminally liable and subject to civil or criminal prosecution in the event of an accident regarding the overfiilled cylinder that was out of your control?

Has there ever been a case like this involving overfilling LP steel tanks?

The only cylinder explosions I am aware of are involving 100% O2 bottles and Aluminum tank fill failures in compromised/failed neck threads.

 

[Wookie]

Has there ever been a case like this involving overfilling LP steel tanks?

The only cylinder explosions I am aware of are involving 100% O2 bottles and Aluminum tank fill failures in compromised/failed neck threads.

I have never heard of such a case. I have never heard of a case of a lawsuit regarding filling cylinders of any type.

I think part of the reason for this is the hyper-vigilance of the SCUBA "Industry" and extreme aversity to opening oneself up to liability. Fill Station operators have procedures pounded into their head by all of the cylinder safety training organizations. Like annual cylinder inspections, good practice rises to the level of "SCUBA Law", and lore becomes standard practice.

 

[crofrog]

Would you be held criminally liable and subject to civil or criminal prosecution in the event of an accident regarding the overfiilled cylinder that was out of your control?

Absolutely.

It’s a bit more grey than that specifically for recreational diving

 

[Wookie]

It’s a bit more grey than that specifically for recreational diving

If you get someone to cave fill your steel 95, and you have a completely unrelated accident while driving across the bridge to Solomons, and the damaged valve of the scuba cylinder in the back of your pickup shot off and killed the baby in the car behind you, I almost guarantee that your lawyer or opposing council would be sure to name the fill station, FSO, and person who put it in your truck to share in the bounty of the award, especially if there were a cool million in insurance to gather from the fill station.

I've been around lawyers. Winning at any cost is their motto.

 

[Capt Jim Wyatt]

I have never heard of a case of a lawsuit regarding filling cylinders of any type

Cave Excursions was sued 15 years ago or so for an O2 cylinder explosion that killed one the employees instantly.

It was not being filled when the explosion occurred. It was being passed off from the diver to the fill station employee when they fumbled it.

 

[Capt Jim Wyatt]

I've been around lawyers. Winning at any cost is their motto.

Tort lawyers, ambulance chasers are the scum of the legal profession.

 

[Wookie]

Cave Excursions was sued 15 years ago or so for an O2 cylinder explosion that killed one the employees instantly.

It was not being filled when the explosion occurred. It was being passed off from the diver to the fill station employee when they fumbled it.

My exact point. I've not heard of a lawsuit resulting from a filling incident.

I have no idea of the outcome of the Cave Excursions lawsuit, but if the cylinder were filled to 4K, which I have done absentmindedly in a HP steel of Oxygen, and it had exploded completely unrelatedly, there would be a lawsuit, with violating the fill station regulations being a slam dunk.