Yukon tangent thread

[Trampmastafunk]

I'm not taking sides on the dive boat leaving being an issue, but I will say this:

If trying to prosecute the dive boat for a criminal charge, then the prosecution would have to prove that they were at fault "beyond a reasonable doubt." If they go after the dive boat in a tort case, all they have to prove is negligence on the defendants part.

 

[Jax]

Does anyone know if the San Diego County's Medical Examiner will update its website with the cause of death? Or do they post the initial report and do nothing else?

 

[Thalassamania]

I'm not taking sides on the dive boat leaving being an issue, but I will say this:

If trying to prosecute the dive boat for a criminal charge, then the prosecution would have to prove that they were at fault "beyond a reasonable doubt." If they go after the dive boat in a tort case, all they have to prove is negligence on the defendants part.

Actually, if trying to prosecute an individual who was on the dive boat on a criminal charge, then the prosecution would have to prove that they guilty of the charged crime "beyond a reasonable doubt;" but if a plaintiff goes after someone of the dive boat, or it's owner, in a civil case, what they have to prove is negligence based on the preponderance of the evidence.

 

[Oside Jimc]

Does anyone know if the San Diego County's Medical Examiner will update its website with the cause of death? Or do they post the initial report and do nothing else?

Knowing our local agencies I would not hold my breath for an update.

 

[ItsBruce]

I believe that a "special relationship" does exist and thus there is a duty incumbent upon the divemaster to enter the water and attempt to rescue a distressed diver; and that there is a similar duty on the captain to assist the divemaster in doing so..

While I respect your belief, I don't think a court in California would have the same belief.

For example, in the case of Zepeda v. City of Los Angeles (1990) 223 Cal.App.3d 232, the court held that paramedics were not liable when they watched a gunshot victim bleed to death without giving him first aid. The court held that the paramedics had no duty to come to his aid and therefore could not be liable.

And, in the case of Williams v. State of California (1983) 34 Cal.3d 18, the California Supreme Court remarked that someone on the beach had no duty to so much as lift a finger to help a drowning man in the water.

As such, if the dive boat were run like they are in some places, where the DM is a shepherd, there might be a duty, but I just don't see one where the culture is that the DM is just an onboard wrangler.

 

[ItsBruce]

I'm not taking sides on the dive boat leaving being an issue, but I will say this:

If trying to prosecute the dive boat for a criminal charge, then the prosecution would have to prove that they were at fault "beyond a reasonable doubt." If they go after the dive boat in a tort case, all they have to prove is negligence on the defendants part.

If the issue is the dive boat having left the site with a diver in the water, the prosecution or plaintiff would have to prove that the diver was alive when the boat left.

If the issue is not preventing the diver's death, someone would first have to prove there was a duty of care, which I don't think could be done.

 

[Thalassamania]

Perhaps the case law in California has changed since I lived there, it has been a while. Back then there was a case where a guy drowned on a beach and an onlooker, who happen to be an off-duty lifeguard wearing orange trunks and patches did not respond. He was held liable on the theory that his presence would have lead a reasonable person to assume that the beach had lifeguards. Sorry, I don't remember the citation.

 

[Tortuga68]

I do not know the diver but Robert most likely had parents

You're more sure that the Humboldt crew were at fault than you are that the diver had parents. Interesting

 

[SC_Hoaty]

Hoaty, do the boats in your area routinely call roll? I cannot remember if the Keys folks did during ITK. Anyone?

There are many folks here with orders of magnitude more dives than me, so this is not your best data point.

Every boat in SC and the Keys that I have been on has called roll, by name, both before we left the inlet (not always before we left the dock) and after every dive.

Divers were NOT checked in and out of the water - roll was called when it was thought all were on board. Generally, one of the crew is doing a head count to figure out how many are still off the boat until it is thought all are onboard- then the roll is called.

 

[deepstops]

Hoaty, do the boats in your area routinely call roll? I cannot remember if the Keys folks did during ITK. Anyone?

They absolutely do (out of Myrtle Beach Anyway) and did at ITK (and every other day as well).