Work permit situation and a ramble

[Red Sea Shadow]

Where's the money? Are there lots of Egyptians spending Egyptian money in Europe wanting familiar Egyptian language and faces in Europe, or are there lots of Europeans spending Euros and Pounds and wanting to hear familiar European languages with familiar Euro faces in Egypt?


If Egypt wants the tourists to spend money in Egypt, they'll keep issuing permits and employing people who make the tourists feel at home. Or the tourists go elsewhere and take their money with them. Europe doesn't need Egypts tourists money, so they don't need to issue permits or employ Egyptians.


Simple, Nearly everything can be explained by following the money.

Tourists need one thing: satisfaction (aka good service). They want the people looking after them to meet or even exceed their expectations. Linking this to being European has no meaning.

 

[Red Sea Shadow]

I don't agree that languages are important at all. There are too many instructors working worldwide; with little or no experience, who are hired simply because they can speak 3 or more languages.

Who would you hire? An instructor with 3 languages or an instructor with the same years of experience and certification level, dove "elsewhere", yet with only one language?

 

[Ste Wart]

Who would you hire? An instructor with 3 languages or an instructor with the same years of experience and certification level, dove "elsewhere", yet with only one language?

Depends on who impressed me most in the interview.

 

[Red Sea Shadow]

Depends on who impressed me most in the interview.

True, only when there's an interview!

Nowadays, people just send their CVs by email. Of course a local will be always available for interviews, but what about foreigners?

 

[Ste Wart]

True, only when there's an interview!

Nowadays, people just send their CVs by email. Of course a local will be always available for interviews, but what about foreigners?

I've had several phone interviews before now. One boss I arranged to meet at a dive show. And others have Skyped. One even asked me to write them an e-mail in one of the foreign languages I spoke (I can teach in Danish). Then there are trial periods etc etc.
There is plenty of ways to vet a potential candidate. Even in Egypt. You could probably get away with sticking a 'trial' instructor down on the boat list for a few weeks/ months instead of getting them a CDWS card straight away.

 

[Red Sea Shadow]

I've had several phone interviews before now. One boss I arranged to meet at a dive show. And others have Skyped. One even asked me to write them an e-mail in one of the foreign languages I spoke (I can teach in Danish). Then there are trial periods etc etc.
There is plenty of ways to vet a potential candidate. Even in Egypt. You could probably get away with sticking a 'trial' instructor down on the boat list for a few weeks/ months instead of getting them a CDWS card straight away.

Actually Egypt was the easiest, since you don't have to depart to get your work permit. Also lengthy "touristic" visas help evaluate instructors through a probation period.

However, this has nothing to do with being more (or less) traveled. As you said before, you'd choose the more appealing candidate. If both candidates pass the interview, would you hire both for a probation period?

 

[Ste Wart]

Actually Egypt was the easiest, since you don't have to depart to get your work permit. Also lengthy "touristic" visas help evaluate instructors through a probation period.

However, this has nothing to do with being more (or less) traveled. As you said before, you'd choose the more appealing candidate. If both candidates pass the interview, would you hire both for a probation period?

Well both candidates can't pass the interview. That's the point of an interview.

Here's the quandary. The uni-linguilist, is by all chances an English speaker. Therefore I can easily vet their skills, both written and verbal. However the tri-lingual will speak 2 languages I don't understand. Now if this is a German speaking English and maybe French. Then fine his skills for briefing in German are without question, and I would be in place to take any courses in English if I was unsatisfied with his English capabilities. But I can't speak French ,therefore I have no way of knowing if he can indeed teach, to an acceptable, standard in French. While his skills as an instructor may work, how I'm to know if he can brief successfully? I would then need another member of staff to speak french to tell me.
Which is why dive centers try to cater for certain groups e.g. werner lau; Germans, Colona; Scandinavians.
So if dive centres are being specific about their customers, surely they would want instructors from those specific countries to staff them?

 

[Crowley]

The big centres with the relationships with the travel angencies? For sure they need the foreign staff. People go specifically to those centres to be trained in, or guided by, fluent speakers of their own language. Egyptians do seem to have a talent for languages and for sure I have met plenty who can DM a boat... but teach OW or Rescue or even DM in fluent German? Sorry, few and far between and valuable staff to have.

For me here in Sharm - what would happen if all the foreign staff left? Many divers would leave Sharm. Would that really matter? Nope, because actually as a percentage of overall income for sharm, it would leave a hole, but one I think could be easily filled. The glass-bottomed boats and submarines make more money per day than all the big dive centres combined.

The thing is - I can feel it here now. I feel a little let down that I followed the revolution closely. believed in it, lost work and money and friends because of it; went and danced in the streets when it all ended...

...and the end result is a campaign to drive my friends and I out of here. Yay.

So there are rumours of a march on Sharm on Friday 15th - and we shall wait and see what happens.

C.

 

[Red Sea Shadow]

Well both candidates can't pass the interview. That's the point of an interview.

Here's the quandary. The uni-linguilist, is by all chances an English speaker. Therefore I can easily vet their skills, both written and verbal. However the tri-lingual will speak 2 languages I don't understand. Now if this is a German speaking English and maybe French. Then fine his skills for briefing in German are without question, and I would be in place to take any courses in English if I was unsatisfied with his English capabilities. But I can't speak French ,therefore I have no way of knowing if he can indeed teach, to an acceptable, standard in French. While his skills as an instructor may work, how I'm to know if he can brief successfully? I would then need another member of staff to speak french to tell me.
Which is why dive centers try to cater for certain groups e.g. werner lau; Germans, Colona; Scandinavians.
So if dive centres are being specific about their customers, surely they would want instructors from those specific countries to staff them?

Two candidates can indeed pass an interview then go through a screening process (which is what you described above). Interestingly, it all speaks about language abilities (tangibles) and their verification. Nothing mentioned regarding traveling (intangible) and its effect on being a better instructor

Hope you get my idea. And BTW, Werner Lau caters for even more Scandinavians than Germans, mainly because of their staff excellent linguistic abilities. Colona tends to have a lot of Polish as far as I'm aware.

 

[Ste Wart]

Two candidates can indeed pass an interview then go through a screening process (which is what you described above). Interestingly, it all speaks about language abilities (tangibles) and their verification. Nothing mentioned regarding traveling (intangible) and its effect on being a better instructor

.

Sorry you asked me to make a point on identical candidates with different language abilities. The variable of dive experience was not part of your query. Hence why I didn't answer it.
In answer to your question. I would look at the instructors previous experience and make the judgement based on where they have dived (assuming they are not a newbie). If I had a choose between a red sea purebred and another who could show experience of a variety of different environments, then it's a no-brainer. I would take the latter and my customers would benefit from their experience.

Besides, the red sea is like diving in a swimming pool anyway