Will Air Integration in dive computers replace the SPG?

[dumpsterDiver]

The marine environment is a lot less forgiving than a hospital room. SPG's rarely fail. They generally will eventually flood and even then, you can dive for a day (or probably longer) before corrosion kills it. the HP hoses rarely explode, they along with the gages themselves, generally (not always) give you fair warning by releasing bubbles etc. Even if the hose explodes into two pieces it is not as much as an emergency as a failure of the LP hoses.

I have always been amamazed about ow utterly crappy the spg swivel, spindel, spool, whatever it is call is made. It is crazy! You got this big honking 3 or 4 gage console hanging off this tiny little rotating mechanical spindle that relies upon two tiny little O-rings.

I always thought there was room for improvement if the design was modified to have some kind of external bearings or something that would take the abuse and allow the spool to allow the gage to spin without all the stress on it.

The design is pretty much universal and unchanged for over 40 years now, per my observation.

 

[undrwater]

They'd be freeken heavy!! Also likely cause interference from the transmitter to the DC.

Andy, you're right, this idea is not fully realized for your type of diving. It is, however, great for recreational dives and divers who are self sufficient. I don't trust my AI setup enough, so I have a clipped off SPG (which I read more than I do the DC). Yes, added failure point, but no big deal for the kinds of dives I do. I have to sync my transmitter and DC...sometimes forget to. This means I don't get the data I want. If syncing happened automatically, that would be nice.

 

[DevonDiver]

If it were statistically proven or time tested AI is as or more reliable than an SPG and meeting the other requirements we've discussed I think it's quite possible it will replace the SPG, at least in the recreational diving world.

Yes, that's certainly possible - even for tech (eventually). But the reliability, form factor and costs are far from being on par with an analogue SPG.

We also have to consider 'wants versus needs', whether that is for cost or safety... many divers (rec or tech) wouldn't find the benefit (whether convenience or data tracking) sufficient motivation to justify any extra cost, or potential drawbacks.

As an aside, the 'convenience' benefit is really quite disputable. To me, it's just a matter of muscle memory and instinctive dive habits. Checking an analogue SPG becomes habitual, programmed and virtually unnoticed with sufficient repetition.

I've heard people citing benefits for photographers etc.... but, in all honesty, no photographer is subjected to the sort of demands that a technical or overhead diver gets used to.... but I don't hear cave, wreck or technical divers complaining about being unable to monitor their gas effectively.

For what it's worth, I routinely shoot video inside of wrecks, whilst running line, whilst supervising divers, whilst controlling a torch, whilst navigating inside confusing and cramped areas.... and, if videoing divers/students... I'm often back-kicking also. I still read my gas off SPGs... although, often, I'm not even conscious I'm doing it.

Using AI prevents that ingrained, habitual mental/muscle pattern from ever developing... which, I think, sometimes reinforces divers' beliefs that AI is an indispensable aid to situational awareness.

 

[abscuba]

Folks are starting to go in circle. Recreational diving and tech diving are different as posted many times by tech divers with thousands of dives. Observations can be made but a lot of the tech side is counter intuitive and unless you have experience in that type of diving won't make sense. AI is good technology and is a great tool for recreational diving. It is just not what is needed in technical diving. Every tech diver who has posted has and does recreational scuba diving and most of us teach it. I would recommend AI to any of my recreational students as for that type of diving it can be handy. So as you cross that line into overhead or deco things change and requirements change. There is no one tool for every job which is why most of us have multiple kits. Recreational computers are better for recreational diving because they have features that are useful in that realm AI is one of those features. Tech computers are designed for a different type of diving. To go with the car analogy being used yes there are drive by wire cars and they are great to drive and those cars have a lot of features like automatic breaking and what not, they keep a lot of people safe. No take it to an indy car race and you will probably end up in a wall because the car is not built to do that. Flip around and take the indy car down a city street and again you would have a hard time as it is not designed to be there. Different tools for different environment.

 

[DevonDiver]

What's better.... a Ferrari, a Prius or a Hummer?

The answer is obviously that it depends on the parameters of use and need.

What people seem to want is a mix of all 3... and they hope that such a mix would be as good in every aspect as a dedicated-to-function machine would be. Wishful thinking at best.

Hence, tech divers have stated they wouldn't want a Petrel to be modified over it's 'near-perfect' current state for technical diving. Wheras rec divers want the Petrel to cater for their needs... but still retain what makes it special. That's counter-logical.

Some people seem to think that the tech divers have been inflexible... but perhaps it's (some of) the rec divers who are too inexperienced, or too inflexible to consider that advanced divers have more specific needs and priorities.

Regards AI in the future... I'm sure of it. We'll also have nano-bots in our bloodstream to track microbubbles and saturation... or blood proteins which indicate early DCS/bubble activity..... perhaps one day those nano-bots will even deal with the bubbles for us...maybe with some transplanted molecular bubble filter and extraction... and deco might become a thing of the past...

 

[Germie]

no, as I sometimes dive with 6-8 cylinders, how can I check easely what cylinder has how much gas? All on 1 computerscreen makes it not easy readable

 

[Tassi Devil Diver]

In a word NO. Where I dive very few divers, maybe around 10% use AI.

AI is significantly more expensive, less reliable, less robust than a standard SPG.

 

[AfterDark]

AI will not be replacing my SPG for sure. I build and test hi-tech computerized components. The amount of problems I see with these items leads me to distrust such technology for use in scuba diving. Besides I dived for almost 5 years before being able to buy an SPG. They are nice but not essential.

 

[CuzzA]

I completely understand why some divers would not consider AI as being a good solution today. When you really think about it though it's nothing more than relocating the information and adding a couple more calculations. I wanted to hear what others thought would be required of the technology to have it replace the SPG.

From my observations in life once technology starts to gets rollng in a market it really starts expanding exponentially and older tech gets replaced. Smartphones are the perfect example of that. IMO, I think some of the responses in this thread are a little close minded. For example, it's my belief that rebreathers will replace typical scuba equipment in the future. The tech is there, but the price is the biggest drawback. Kind of like the first CD player... What did it cost, $1,000? Everyone wanted one, but couldn't justify the cost. Eventually you could buy them for $100 and everyone owned one. I'm sure most of us here would love a $15,000 CCR to extend dive time, shorten deco, explore greater depths and get rid of the LOUD bubbles. But, not until they're closer in price to standard scuba equipment. One day they will. And when AI is equal in price to the SPG, my guess is the the SPG will become obsolete, at least in rec diving.

I'll have to remember to come back and bump this thread when it happens.

 

[chrisch]

...
From my observations in life once technology starts to gets rollng in a market it really starts expanding exponentially and older tech gets replaced. Smartphones are the perfect example of that.

Smartphones are mobile data devices they have not replaced mobile telephones but displaced them. If you want to make a phone call the old technology is vastly superior. The mobile data device has a much shorter battery life and often not such good reception. Of course, you cannot surf the Internet on a phone, so many people choose a mobile data device with a telephony app on it. This is a good example of your thinking about SPG - smartphones have not fully replaced mobile phones nor ever will they.

...IMO, I think some of the responses in this thread are a little close minded. For example, it's my belief that rebreathers will replace typical scuba equipment in the future. The tech is there, but the price is the biggest drawback.

No, the biggest drawback is the level of training needed and the fact that the equipment is not as robust as OC. In this example you are (currently) wrong because legislation will hold back rebreathers from further development. Recreational level rebreathers have been tried and failed.

...Kind of like the first CD player... What did it cost, $1,000? Everyone wanted one, but couldn't justify the cost. Eventually you could buy them for $100 and everyone owned one. I'm sure most of us here would love a $15,000 CCR to extend dive time, shorten deco, explore greater depths and get rid of the LOUD bubbles. But, not until they're closer in price to standard scuba equipment. One day they will.

I am sure that if rebreathers fall significantly in price they will gain a much larger market share. Possibly even overtake OC one day. That is not replacement though IMHO.

...And when AI is equal in price to the SPG, my guess is the the SPG will become obsolete, at least in rec diving.

I'll have to remember to come back and bump this thread when it happens.

For recreational level diving you may well be right, but I doubt the price differential will ever become zero. Marketing doesn't work that way - if a product is perceived as superior it is priced higher and can thus gain a bigger margin. that is how the world works - it's all about the profit.