Why NOT DIR?

[texdiveguy]

In my GUE courses, the term DIR was NEVER used once.

Your nose appears a bit longer......give the world a break. I have been at this a long time......when GUE is mentioned so comes DIR and that is in general conversations. I think your memory is just forgeting....to much SB posting.

 

[underwasser bolt]

Hey King,

I just got through reading through some of your older posts just to see where you are coming from and it looks like you are a fairly new diver. I really don't see how you have experienced as many arrogant DIR divers in real life as you make out.

Obviously it's possible that you might live in some DIR epicenter of prick divers but my guess is your opinion is based off of what you have experienced on the internet. Four years ago I was the same way when I got (re)certified. I assumed DIR meant arrogant divers until I actually meet some. I would strongly encourage to take a fundies class or maybe sit in on a Fundies opening sessions - some instructors will let you. This will give you a chance to experience what it is from the source.

sloth, that is one heck of a good point, and is food for thought.

 

[Rainer]

Actually, it's rather the salesmen.

Nice pitch though, you have a real future in customer relations. What's next, insult my nationality or religion?

I'm sorry, I'm so clearly mistaken. You're obviously a joy to spend the day with . . . please sign me up so I can be abused more!

I'm not insulting you. I'm challenging you to move past marketing. No GUE divers here have said that their method of diving is "right". You have. Hmmmm. Again, if someone dives DiveRite, do they have to believe all other gear is wrong? No. Why do you believe DIR is different? Feel free to continue to avoid an actual discussion.

 

[Rainer]

Your nose appears a bit longer......give the world a break.

Nope, wasn't used. Sit in on a class. Most instructors would be happy to have you audit. If you care enough to think you're right, prove me wrong. The term wasn't used once.

 

[Rainer]

believe it or not, there are probably plenty of non-DIR divers out there that can out-dive you (or me).

LOL, of course!

 

[underwasser bolt]

Please point out all the posts where GUE divers are suggesting those who do not dive as GUE suggests will die? Please point out where GUE divers are suggesting only their method is right. If a substantial portion of GUE divers are doing these things, please link to all these posts. Put up or ...

some of our experiences are not based on "posts"; many of them are based on "real" life diving experiences. imagine that. BTW, it is hard to link "real" dive experience to the internet.

 

[underwasser bolt]

Nope, wasn't used. Sit in on a class. Most instructors would be happy to have you audit. If you care enough to think you're right, prove me wrong. The term wasn't used once.

perhaps it was not; I understand that GUE is so spun by the negative, especially from those like this post, that they are distancing from DIR terminoloy. Smart move. But can they move away from the attitude?

 

[Rainer]

some of our experiences are not based on "posts"; many of them are based on "real" life diving experiences. imagine that. BTW, it is hard to link "real" dive experience to the internet.

All I can tell you is that I have personally NEVER seen this here in MA/CT/ME/RI where I dive. I've NEVER told anyone I think what GUE teaches is the "right way to dive". It's simply how I dive. If anything, I do it because it's a good way (IMO!!!) to learn to safely dive (I wasn't safe coming out of OW). There's a good chance if I already knew how to safely dive (that need NOT be DIR!), I might not be interested in GUE tranining either. It's "A" system, not "THE" system. Everyone I've ever met who has actually taken a GUE course and with whom I've discussed this feels the same way. This includes GUE instructors.

 

[Cave Diver]

Ok then here are my questions

On 200' wreck dive can I

Put SPG on my left chest D ring?
Attach my can light to the right side of my plate and carry it in my right hand?
Put 40% (also can I use 40%) on my left side and 100% on my right?
Use 19/35 back gas?
Use a computer?
Bungee my long hose between my wing and right tank?
And lastly do it solo?

Can you do it, yes. Be "DIR compliant," No.

SPG on the chest could interferfere with clipping off deco bottles. If you can arrange it so it's still accessible/visible without bowing, dangling, creating excess drag or entanglement hazard, then it meets the criteria.

Can light needs to be ditchable. It's considered ballast and in an emergency you should be able to dump it (although I'd hate to dump a $1k light!). If it's secured on the right side in a way that makes this possible, while still being able to hold the long hose securely, then it meets the criteria.

A 200' dive would call for 18/45 and 50% and 100% Both deco bottles should be on the left side so as to not interfere with the long hose deployment.

In regards to computer usage, a computer may be used under this critera: "Divers that choose to use computers should do so after becoming well-versed in diving limits and then using the computers primarily as an educational tool."

In other words, you can use a computer, but you need to understand the information it is giving you and have a backup plan in the event it fails/floods,falls off, gets eaten by a shark. Plan the dive beforehand and dont blindly rely on the information the computer spits out at you. (Surprise with this one eh?)

Bungied long hose, no. The concern here is being able to restow it easily after the reason for deployment is resolved. (i.e once you get to deco stop and switch to bottles from backgas, you dont want it just flapping around cuz you cant get it back into bungies easily).

Solo. No. DIR is above all, centered around a team diving concept.

 

[limeyx]

That's fine, as I've oft observed we each have the right to go to hell in the handbasket of our own choosing. I'd be very sorry to see you go that way. But that's not my point ... my point is that here is a much more clear and present danger than a lot of things that have defined DIR requirements yet DIR ignores the issue, likely because it's not a cave issue ... it's a second order problem that has caused fatalities in open water, that they did not think about ... it's what we call caveblind.

Possibly it's a danger. The rubber weight belt actually sounds quite interesting, providing it's not something that will rot and corrode in salt water.

I see the likelihood of getting so hopelessly entangled such that neither me or a buddy can free ourselves, but somehow can get out of our gear and get free as a risk I am willing to take I guess.

I do admit that it's hard to reach back and free something behind you, but I just think that either a buddy can help, or loosening the harness should be possible.

Maybe I am just doing the "easy" diving where I don't see such conditions.

I would definitely not call myself a "cave diver" as I'm just beginning that route, and I wouldn't necessarily say GUE is caveblind.

Neither is the GUE/DIR way the one way that is "perfect" in all conditions.
It's just (for me) a way that's "pretty darned good" for the range of diving I am ever likely to do, and the benefits of one standard rig, one set of procedures I think are a huge benefit.

Here, the biggest issue with entanglement is kelp -- and people have died from it.
Usually this is caused by the diver surfacing in kelp, descending to get below it, but not having enough gas (or a buddy close enough).