Why NOT DIR?

[Thalassamania]

Well, I don't think that is true and would agree with you. (and I bet some others would as well)

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2808701&postcount=1

But Jeff, after Lynne you're about the most reasonable DIR diver I know.

 

[JeffG]

But Jeff, after Lynne you're about the most reasonable DIR diver I know.

ack..pfffft...

I shouldn't of been drinking coffee when I read that.

 

[Divin'Papaw]

1. Availability of local training ... None local, some semi-local but only 1-2 times a year
2. Availability of like minded buddies ... if I went DIR and only dove DIR, my diving would be severely diminished
3. The team-oriented requirements and general diving protocols are excessive for the vast majority of the types of diving that I do
4. I'll eventually begin to occasionally dive solo
5. A good number of DIR divers don't come across as ... shall we say ... open and inviting. Certainly not all, but many. I dive for fun and enjoyment. Why would I choose a philosophy advocated by a group of divers that frequently come across as elitist snobs? Life is too short for that crap. Not a universal DIR issue, but all too common unfortunately.

 

[Lead_carrier]

There are many who choose NOT.

This is an opportunity for them to discuss things they are opposed to in the DIR style and open up the discussion for the reasons why.

Very simply, I'm not allowed. I smoke.

 

[Guba]

Ditto to Hoosier (well, except for the diving solo...I'm gregarious).

Of course, I could be totally misled since my only contact with DIR divers is--where else--on the internet (as in this forum). That's hardly a fair sample, so I reserve complete judgement until I've actually met some DIR associated divers. In the meantime, I'll simply have to limp along knowing that I'm NOT DIR...does that make me wrong?

 

[Thalassamania]

OK, it looks like we may be able to have a little fun here and a rationale discussion, with that in mind here's something I posted on another site:

”No weight belt is worn. Instead, two manifolded steel tanks of 12 or more litres provide negative buoyancy even when empty. If more weight is needed, a heavy stainless steel backplate is used. If even more weight is required, a long lead weight (V-weight) is bolted to the backplate between the tanks. By eliminating the weight belt, the Hogarth system eliminates a source of danger from accidental release and line entanglement, inefficiency due to extra mass and drag, and discomfort.” – Billy Williams, “In the Beginning"

Let’s take a critical look at William’s analysis:

1. Indeed sufficient negative buoyancy can be obtained with steel tanks, a stainless steel backplate and a V-weight.
2. Does this “eliminates a source of danger from accidental release" Yes it does. But is it the only way to eliminate such a danger? No it is not. There are many other ways, ranging from double buckles, to wire buckles on rubber belts, to harness systems.
3. Does it decrease the danger of entanglement? In a lifetime of working around nets and lines and kelp I have never had my weightbelt be part of an entanglement problem. I think that this argument is specious at worst and apocryphal at best.
4. Does a weightbelt create “inefficiency due to extra mass and drag?” No it does not, there’s no extra mass and the drag of a weightbelt is negligible.
5. Can a weightbelt create an discomfort? Yes it can. Most discomforts can be solved with a little care and thought.

What do you gain by using a weightbelt:

1. Cheap ballast that can be ditched in an emergency … granted that’s likely a bad idea to do so inside a cave or a wreck.
2. Dynamic control of pitch. Are your feet a little heavy: slide it up a hair, is your head down a dash: slide it back a bit.
3. Greatly increased control should you need to remove your rig for any reason

Thoughts?

 

[Rainer]

OK, it looks like we may be able to have a little fun here and a rationale discussion, with that in mind here's something I posted on another site:

”No weight belt is worn. Instead, two manifolded steel tanks of 12 or more litres provide negative buoyancy even when empty. If more weight is needed, a heavy stainless steel backplate is used. If even more weight is required, a long lead weight (V-weight) is bolted to the backplate between the tanks. By eliminating the weight belt, the Hogarth system eliminates a source of danger from accidental release and line entanglement, inefficiency due to extra mass and drag, and discomfort.” – Billy Williams, “In the Beginning"

Let’s take a critical look at William’s analysis:

1. Indeed sufficient negative buoyancy can be obtained with steel tanks, a stainless steel backplate and a V-weight.
2. Does this “eliminates a source of danger from accidental release" Yes it does. But is it the only way to eliminate such a danger? No it is not. There are many other ways, ranging from double buckles, to wire buckles on rubber belts, to harness systems.
3. Does it decrease the danger of entanglement? In a lifetime of working around nets and lines and kelp I have never had my weightbelt be part of an entanglement problem. I think that this argument is specious at worst and apocryphal at best.
4. Does a weightbelt create “inefficiency due to extra mass and drag?” No it does not, there’s no extra mass and the drag of a weightbelt is negligible.
5. Can a weightbelt create an discomfort? Yes it can. Most discomforts can be solved with a little care and thought.

What do you gain by using a weightbelt:

1. Cheap ballast that can be ditched in an emergency … granted that’s likely a bad idea to do so inside a cave or a wreck.
2. Dynamic control of pitch. Are your feet a little heavy: slide it up a hair, is your head down a dash: slide it back a bit.
3. Greatly increased control should you need to remove your rig for any reason

Thoughts?

I wear a weighbelt (usually 6# in SW). Neither of my two GUE instructors had a problem with it. Most GUE divers I personally know wear weightbelts in SW. Is this really an issue?

 

[Blackwood]

Thoughts?

I agree with your critical look, but fail to see what bearing it has on this particular discussion.

Weight belts are neither DIR nor nor-DIR. Some DIR divers use them, others don't.

 

[TSandM]

My GUE instructor wears a weight belt, even with his RB80. I don't think they care until you get into the caves, and the issues are somewhat different there.

 

[Blackwood]

Most GUE divers I personally know wear weightbelts is SW.

As well they should not. GUE standards don't oppose the use of weight belts.

There are several ways to weight a diving rig; these include weight belts...