EFX
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<< fodder for the cynical mill deleted >>
If PADI is the evil empire of diving then why did you take two courses from them after NAUI? What.....no one accepts NAUI certs???!!!
Why aren't more people taking up scuba diving?
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<< fodder for the cynical mill deleted >>
If PADI is the evil empire of diving then why did you take two courses from them after NAUI? What.....no one accepts NAUI certs???!!!
NoDecoBob
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Regardless it was still a nice rant. I only have a few 1000 posts. Of course most of them are in the PUB which I am proud to say I have survived and am a resident of. Lots of rants in that part of the forum. With a rant like yours perhaps you should take a peek. I spent 3 days in San Francisco about 15 years ago, does that give me tenure there?
There are many threads here that turn into PADI bashing threads, your rant is one of thousands. No offense intended. PADI has added more people to the list of people who have taken up Scuba Diving than any other agency. Keeping them interested is a different matter. I was PADI trained and let me assure you I love the sport and have no intentions of quitting, in fact I dream of being able to go diving more now than I did the past 60 years.
EDIT. I do not believe for 1 second that PADI is the reason the number of people taking up scuba diving is declining, in fact I would suggest it is part of the reason the sport has grown as much as it has. Once again, this isn't about keeping someone interested in diving, it is why they don't take it up to begin with.
There are many threads here that turn into PADI bashing threads, your rant is one of thousands. No offense intended. PADI has added more people to the list of people who have taken up Scuba Diving than any other agency. Keeping them interested is a different matter. I was PADI trained and let me assure you I love the sport and have no intentions of quitting, in fact I dream of being able to go diving more now than I did the past 60 years.
EDIT. I do not believe for 1 second that PADI is the reason the number of people taking up scuba diving is declining, in fact I would suggest it is part of the reason the sport has grown as much as it has. Once again, this isn't about keeping someone interested in diving, it is why they don't take it up to begin with.
NoDecoBob
Registered
<< fodder for the cynical mill deleted >>
If PADI is the evil empire of diving then why did you take two courses from them after NAUI? What.....no one accepts NAUI certs???!!!
A valid question! And you also make my point regarding the NAUI certs... I did not form the opinion that I now have (of PADI) until after obtaining my certs. In fact, I even purchased a PADI OW class for my girlfriend for Christmas to introduce her to the sport...and a damn fine diver she has become. Everyone that I have ever had the pleasure of dealing with in the dive community accepts NAUI certs. But I have never been sold instruction from a NAUI instructor under the auspices of not being able to dive unless I had one of their certification cards in my log. Nor have I been led to believe one thing from one NAUI instructor, to be told something entirely contradictory by another...like I have from a PADI instructor...just sayin'.
I know may have ruffled a few feathers with this post, or maybe just showed a really big case of my ass...but some of you (you included) make the point for me...I can fill my tanks with my NAUI certs just as full as I can with a PADI cert, and continue my dive education through other channels.
I just chose to use this board to share the experience...isnt it what it's for?
---------- Post added September 22nd, 2014 at 07:58 PM ----------
I wonder if that chip on his shoulder effects his buoyancy?
It does not...only because I stay trim with another chip of equal size and weight on the other shoulder.
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NoDecoBob, PADI has it's faults and takes it's lumps now and then on SB. And there are jokes and acronyms. But you were overboard. I was never pressured into any PADI course, including DM by either the shop where I DM or another "5 star" PADI shop in FL where I took quite a few courses. Yes it's a business, but I'm not sure about the pyramid. Our instructors do mention to OW students the benefits of doing the AOW course and especially doing Rescue eventually. I mention Rescue myself--can't think that is bad advice. But I can't think of an occasion where anything was pushed. And we DMs actually get paid to assist. I did get ONE notice from PADI included in my Master Diver package suggesting I "Go Pro". Maybe that's the pyramid? The MSD thing was completely my idea. I didn't even know of the "MSD Challenge". I guess things vary from place to place, but those have been my experiences.
NoDecoBob
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None taken. And thank you for the pointers of where to make future rants...I tried to make sure I was in the right forum before firing both barrels. My apologies if I crossed some sort if internet etiquette boundary...purely out of inexperience.
I make no argument to the success that PADI has enjoyed in increasing the number within the dive community's ranks. Their bottom line certainly shows that. What I do take issue with is the way they continue with the business of marketing vs. educating. Keeping divers interested wont be their issue...keeping PADI divers will be.
We share the same passion for diving Mr. Moore...I have no intentions of quitting either. I'm just going to be a little more selective as to who I receive my education from, and who gets my dive dollars.
Now...can you show me the way to that PUB?
http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/pub/
You can try this. It is a double opt in so beware.
You can try this. It is a double opt in so beware.
None taken. And thank you for the pointers of where to make future rants...I tried to make sure I was in the right forum before firing both barrels. My apologies if I crossed some sort if internet etiquette boundary...purely out of inexperience.
I make no argument to the success that PADI has enjoyed in increasing the number within the dive community's ranks. Their bottom line certainly shows that. What I do take issue with is the way they continue with the business of marketing vs. educating. Keeping divers interested wont be their issue...keeping PADI divers will be.
We share the same passion for diving Mr. Moore...I have no intentions of quitting either. I'm just going to be a little more selective as to who I receive my education from, and who gets my dive dollars.
Now...can you show me the way to that PUB?
NoDecoBob
Registered
Mr Heimer...I do not believe I was "overboard". Let me tell you the reason for my rant...
I attended a PADI "Pro Night" at said sporting goods store. I also took 4 friends with me...2 that wanted to gain certification, and 2 that were looking to continue their dive education. You couldn't swing a dead cat in the place without hitting an OWSI...we got the opportunity to speak with several. My girlfriend (looking to obtain her AOW - and has more dives than you were required to have when you started your DM program) showed that she had completed her KR's, showed her dive log book where a PADI instructor had signed off on 5 specialty dives required to obtain AOW (on a trip to Roatan 3 weeks ago), and paid tuition for the AOW class at said sporting goods store, spoke to an instructor that took her pic card and student folder and told her to come to a lake over 100 miles away during the weekend, and he would do a couple of dives with her and review her KR's with her and call her AOW certified. So after the expense of securing a hotel room by the lake, and making sure I had (4) full 80's in the trunk to haul down there, we show up on Saturday morning to get these dives in...just to be approached by so-called instructor from your illustrious association and told that the other instructors he was there with didn't think (obviously) that it was a good idea to do it this way, as anyone could sign a log book. He asked that she come back with a form to verify the PADI Instructor. When I asked him what form, he said the previous instructor would know what was needed.
This, Mr. PADI DiveMaster, is bull****. AS an OWSI you should know what you're going to do before you suggest that someone go to any expense to meet your criteria, and if you can't then you keep your so-called professional mouth shut.
We dived that day. I told my girlfriend that in the rescue course, should she ever decide to take it from PADI, she'd learn to recognize diver stress...I was a good example that day. You know what the #1 cause of diver stress is? PADI Instructors.
We went back to said sporting goods giant yesterday. She got her money back for the tuition paid on Pro Night, and I got a refund for the DM course, and the 5 specialty courses (and associated collateral) that I paid for that night (over $1000). And by the way...the reason I bought the 5 specialty courses is because some OWSI told me that they were required in order to complete the DM program. Guess what...they're not. Now why would you suppose an OWSI would tell me they were? Ignorance or used car salesman tactics? You decide...I won't be getting any more PADI certs.
That's my experience.
OP
If a tree falls in the forest but no one is there to hear it... is it still PADI's fault?
Fixed it for you.
Regards,
Ray Purkis
Fixed it for you.
Regards,
Ray Purkis
NoDecoBob
Registered
As I pointed out in my original post Ray...the store, its policies, and instructor staff share the responsibility.
The point I've tried to make here, and seem to have failed so miserably at, is that the business model that these stores and staff members operate under, by direction of PADI, result in these business practices...from the sporting goods giant, all the way down to the mom and pop dive shop...please refer to the Monty Python skit at the very beginning of this thread.
QM@PADI.com (the "no one" of the forest).
SO...in closing I'd like to state that I believe I've spent more air on this subject than it's worth...I'd much rather be in the water than sitting in front of a computer talking about the last time I was. I am now going to go visit my beautiful niece in Long Beach for the day, then hop on over to Catalina for nice dip (or 2!) off Casino Point. Y'all have a great day!!!
RE
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