Which regulator should you donate?

[lamont]

I Don't have time to read all of the responses, and based on the question I guessed what they would be even before I ready any.

I'd have to say that Wendy's question is borderline trolling. From previous posts from her, I am pretty sure she is a staunchly DIR diver, which is fine. However she should know the type of response a question like this is going to bring, which is more or less a division along party lines; DIR and non-DIR.

Any way I don't donate my primary, but would willingly do so if the situation called for it.

Just an observation, but it seems that the biggest difference between DIR and non-DIR is that most non-DIR divers think DIR divers dive differently from them, and leave it at that. However it sems that many DIR divers feel non-DIR divers dive incorrectly and are inferior to them.

Can't we all just get along?

A lot of non-DIR divers dive the long hose as well.

Also, it seems to me that the real difference between DIR and non-DIR is that a lot of DIR divers want to have frank discussions about the risks and benefits of different gear configs, while other divers quickly resort to a defensive "don't tell me how to dive" response. I really don't care how you dive. I think the long hose is better based on my experience training with them and doing one real honest-to-god OOA at 60 fsw with the long hose. If you don't want to read my opinions and you don't want to feel like I'm critisizing you, then don't read this thread. If you want to dive differently, then grow some thicker skin and go do what you want irregardless of what I write. Millions of divers use an octo every year and the vast overwhelming majority don't wind up dead or injured because of it -- does that make you feel better?

 

[lamont]

This boils down to a DIR vs. non DIR argument.

First of all, I'm going to reiterate very strongly that lots of non-DIR divers dive with a long hose. If you understand the DIR gear configuration, go out to a dive site and look at the people wearing the long hose and count the number of people who aren't DIR. Even at dive sites around seattle where we've got a lot of DIR influence from fifthd its usually at least half the people with the long hose clearly aren't DIR.

The DIR camp says treat all OOA emergencies the same. I would think that all OOA emergincies are not the same.
The DIR camp seems to insinuale that the non DIR diver doesn't have sense to test his octopus before a dive or once in the water. They seem to say that they pass off thier primary because they know thier back-up works. Well, I know my back up works also so I'll pass it off thank you. They also seem to think that we don't know where we clipped our octopus off at so we won't be able to find it. Again, that's just a pop shot at the non DIR diver.

No, its really not a pop shot. The claim is not that anyone is incompetent. The claim is that managing gear underwater is difficult for anyone and that you plan for murphy's law to strike you at the worst moments. That means that your buddy is going to OOA you on the dive when your octo had gotten caught up on that rock and gotten pulled out of your bungee holder when you didn't notice. This happens to everyone diving. I must've swam for a few hundred yards a couple weekends ago with my backup mask dangling out of my drysuit pocket between my legs before I figured out what felt funny and fixed it. Am I really assuming a diver is that incompetent by pointing out that their octo could haven fallen out of its holder right when they need it most?

It was my understanding that the whole 7 foot hose was so the cave divers could pass through small passages that only allow divers to pass single file, during an OOA emergency. Why push it on warm water reef divers? It really serves them no purpose.

Yes it does serve a purpose. You've merely tried to label away all those reasons as being irrelevant without actually thinking about them.

Not eveyone desire to be a cave or "tech" diver.
It would seem that this 7 foot hosed wrapped around the body of someone not trained in the proper techniques is more of a hazard to himself during an OOA emergency.

Possibly. That's why you need training on how to manage it.

 

[kalvyn]

It was my understanding that the whole 7 foot hose was so the cave divers could pass through small passages that only allow divers to pass single file, during an OOA emergency. Why push it on warm water reef divers? It really serves them no purpose. Not eveyone desire to be a cave or "tech" diver.
It would seem that this 7 foot hosed wrapped around the body of someone not trained in the proper techniques is more of a hazard to himself during an OOA emergency.

Well... my wife is a warm water reef diver only. When we went to Bonaire in February she used a 7" primary with bungied backup. She got the concept immediately and had no problem donating her primary and going to the bungied backup when we practiced before our first dive. Since we always dive together she understands that the most likely OOA scenario we will run into is when she or I are "mugged from behind" by another diver in the area who grabs the working reg out of our mouth in a panic.

Also, while in Bonaire she decided she wanted a BP/wing like mine (she was diving a regular BC on this trip). After that trip I bought her one. We just got back from 8 dives in Pureto Vallarta and she is 100% sold on the BP/wing, stating it several times to me and others on the boat we were on over the course of our dives. She is not DIR trained; as a matter of fact she is OW certified only.

I did not force any of this gear upon her. She saw and understood the benefits of the long hose config when I explained it to her in discussing my gear choices. She wanted a BP/wing after seeing me dive one for a week in Bonaire. As a matter of fact I told her she might not like the BP/wing, at least the first couple of dives. She took to it better than I did, quite frankly, with no training whatsoever.

Anyone can use anything in diving... it is my belief that when folks try and use some of the "DIR gear", it sells itself. My wife is certainly a prime example of this.

Jimmie

 

[mrv]

Donate my primary, which I breath on a long hose

and switch to my back-up which is bungeed around my neck.

Divers Against Bungeed Wings Of Death??

i´m curios about this issue. haven´t heard arguments against bungeed wings. i have an oms bungeed wings bcd. haven´t ever heard of any tech/wreck/cave diver gotten trapped by the bungees on his bc. could you enlighten me?

cheers,
mrv.

 

[roakey]

i´m curios about this issue. haven´t heard arguments against bungeed wings. i have an oms bungeed wings bcd. haven´t ever heard of any tech/wreck/cave diver gotten trapped by the bungees on his bc. could you enlighten me?
cheers,
mrv.

The search function is always your friend.

http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=3642&highlight=bungee
http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=8597&highlight=bungee

The last one is good proof that censorship is NOT alive and well on this board, because the board owner and I went at it tooth and nail, and I'm still here!

Roak

 

[Firebrand]

It's nice to see threads get hit by the virtual defribulator and come back to life LONG after anyone has posted to them!!!

 

[Web Monkey]

Even though it receives quite a bit of flak around here, I will say one good thing for the Air-2: You can't donate it.

If you have one, you have to donate your primary.

Terry

Not so, Roaky.
NASDS/SSI teaches donating the primary, then switching to the octo when that makes sense (the octo is the long hose).
Rick

 

[Jarrett]

How frequent is this stuck inflator valve issue? I'm still deabting on adding an Atomic SS1 to my setup.