Which regulator should you donate?

[Karl_in_Calif]

JJ in his DIR book devotes a whole chapter on donating the primary reg. I will try to remember some of his arguments. They are pretty good, actually.

First, the reg you are breathing off currently is the only one that you can be sure is totally ready for another diver to begin breathing on. An octo may have initial problems from whatever of several different possible reasons.

Second, the backup on your necklace is the closest place for you to have access to a backup reg, not your hip.

Third, you as the donating buddy are probably more calm at the moment than your OOA buddy, and as such you are the best person to take and clear your own backup reg. If the backup reg has a problem, you can switch to buddy breathing.

Fourth, since your buddy who is OOA is likely to grab your primary reg out of your mouth anyway, that is another reason (although not the primary reason) to donate it anyway.

JJ has revived the donation of the primary reg in an OOA situation. Cave divers have always used this procedure. JJ has publicized it.

I think JJ is right on, in this case. I agree with him.

 

[CincyBengalsFan]

Uncle Pug once bubbled...


Personally when we do OOA drills I don't worry about getting my backup reg into my mouth right away... I won't die instantly. My attention is focused on getting the donated regulator to the OOA diver, making sure they can purge it and that they have taken a breath.

Thanks for the cheap shot unclepug. I don't panic ever and I would love to trade some under skills with you someday and see who panics first or who nearly drowns first.

Panic is the main word used by the 7' hose folks who claim that's why you should give up your primary. But you should already know this, your just taking a cheap shot at me. And your a regulator on this board also. NICE, REAL NICE.

Detroit Diver, I hear what your saying and respect what your saying. But I disagree. I think a paniced diver is not going to think straight enough to even worry about finding gas. He or She, the idiot who just ran out of gas, is going to try to climb to the surface by whatever means.

The old method by cave divers was to still wear it around your neck but that was the backup. At least for some old cave divers not all I'm sure.

 

[CincyBengalsFan]

Karl_in_Calif once bubbled...
JJ in his DIR book devotes a whole chapter on donating the primary reg. I will try to remember some of his arguments. They are pretty good, actually.

First, the reg you are breathing off currently is the only one that you can be sure is totally ready for another diver to begin breathing on. An octo may have initial problems from whatever of several different possible reasons.

Second, the backup on your necklace is the closest place for you to have access to a backup reg, not your hip.

Third, you as the donating buddy are probably more calm at the moment than your OOA buddy, and as such you are the best person to take and clear your own backup reg. If the backup reg has a problem, you can switch to buddy breathing.

Fourth, since your buddy who is OOA is likely to grab your primary reg out of your mouth anyway, that is another reason (although not the primary reason) to donate it anyway.

JJ has revived the donation of the primary reg in an OOA situation. Cave divers have always used this procedure. JJ has publicized it.

I think JJ is right on, in this case. I agree with him.

For cave diving sure I think he's right on. But let's say this paniced diver needs to buddy breath because the diver with Air has an Octo that is Malfunctioning (Which people still can't explain), your telling me that this paniced diver has the capability to buddy breath now...Come on!

 

[sealkie]

A few days back someone posted a story of his OOA donating experience - where the person he was donating to took his octo then threw it away and went for the reg around his neck - and I think in the words of the diver in question 'Proceeded to strangle him"

I admit - it made me think about the breathing off the octo / primary necklace set up - I see all the pros - when diving with experienced and comfortable buddies - but after reading the divers experiences the other day - I can see draw backs when dealing with a panicing new or out or practise diver.

 

[Karl_in_Calif]

sealkie once bubbled...
A few days back someone posted a story of his OOA donating experience - where the person he was donating to took his octo then threw it away and went for the reg around his neck - and I think in the words of the diver in question 'Proceeded to strangle him"

I admit - it made me think about the breathing off the octo / primary necklace set up - I see all the pros - when diving with experienced and comfortable buddies - but after reading the divers experiences the other day - I can see draw backs when dealing with a panicing new or out or practise diver.

The salient problem in that account was that the donating diver had made the mistake of wearing a YELLOW octo on a necklace around his own neck.

We each encouraged him to get rid of the yellow and substitute it with an ordinary black color.

 

[CincyBengalsFan]

sealkie once bubbled...
A few days back someone posted a story of his OOA donating experience - where the person he was donating to took his octo then threw it away and went for the reg around his neck - and I think in the words of the diver in question 'Proceeded to strangle him"

I admit - it made me think about the breathing off the octo / primary necklace set up - I see all the pros - when diving with experienced and comfortable buddies - but after reading the divers experiences the other day - I can see draw backs when dealing with a panicing new or out or practise diver.

Excellent point but who's to say that he might or might not have spit the primary out if he had took it first?

 

[Karl_in_Calif]

CincyBengalsFan once bubbled...


For cave diving sure I think he's right on. But let's say this paniced diver needs to buddy breath because the diver with Air has an Octo that is Malfunctioning (Which people still can't explain), your telling me that this paniced diver has the capability to buddy breath now...Come on!

First, let me agree with the PADI method, as one of several proper alternatives, wherein you POINT to your yellow octo on your hip, and then LEAN away from the panicked diver. This is probably quite appropriate for inexperienced divers new to scuba. I am sure PADI HQ gave this a lot of though before they made it a standard procedure. PADI's call, not mine.

NAUI teaches this somewhat differently. It allows the donating student the option of donating his/her primary and then utilizing his/her own octo, or else the other option of donating his/her octo to the OOA diver.

Fine. Donate the octo. Reason being you are dealing with new divers here. Agreed.

I just do not believe that it is preferred to donate a nonfunctioning octo. I agree with JJ's reasoning.

When I teach students, I teach them to donate their own primary, and then to reach for their own octos and they themselves begin breathing off the octo. If they have a cheap octo, then they will also get religion and cough up enough cash to buy a full service additional second stage instead of a cheap octo for OOA situations.

 

[Don Burke]

sealkie once bubbled... A few days back someone posted a story of his OOA donating experience - where the person he was donating to took his octo then threw it away and went for the reg around his neck - and I think in the words of the diver in question 'Proceeded to strangle him"

I admit - it made me think about the breathing off the octo / primary necklace set up - I see all the pros - when diving with experienced and comfortable buddies - but after reading the divers experiences the other day - I can see draw backs when dealing with a panicing new or out or practise diver.

He was also wearing a yellow regulator at his neck. That's making some OW training work against you.

http://www.scubaboard.com/t38773/s.html

I use one eighth inch surgical tubing for the necklace. If someone grabs it, they'll break it before they hurt me.

 

[Big-t-2538]

CincyBengalsFan once bubbled...

Detroit Diver, I hear what your saying and respect what your saying. But I disagree. I think a paniced diver is not going to think straight enough to even worry about finding gas.

maybe you should re-read that...

A panicked diver is only looking for gas IMO, they don't care where it comes from, or how they have to get it if it isn't shoved in their face.

Panic is onset by never having to deal with any type of escalated situation in your training or previous diving experience. You should always do some sort of high anxiety or panic handling situations when you are training divers IMO. It teaches them how to deal with a situation rather than panic. This does not apply to just OOA...it apply's to entanglement, it applys to silt outs, or whatever you dream up.

 

[Uncle Pug]

CincyBengalsFan once bubbled...
your just taking a cheap shot at me

And the way you blow up into a poof supplies instant gratification.

You are hard to resist Cincy.