Which cert card to present

[Cert1967]

I was recently in a car accident that was 100% the fault of the other driver. I contacted my insurance company, and they flat out told me that I had a good policy in terms of liability, and if the other part were to sue, they would indeed settle immediately without disputing it. That is because in the long run, it is cheaper to make small settlements than it is to fight the cases, even when you are sure you are going to win. They tell you it doesn't cost you anything, and it costs them less than fighting it.

It can be a problem for you, though, in other ways. Let's say you are an instructor involved in some way in a dive that includes a fatality, and you are pretty sure you have no fault. Your insurance company agrees. When you are sued, they offer a small settlement for the reasons stated above, which the plaintiff immediately accepts because they have no case. The settlement is made, as is always the case, "with prejudice," the legal phrase that means they cannot ever sue on that case again. So then after that, someone who does not like you says that your claim that you were not at fault in this case is false, and as evidence they say that the case "was settled with prejudice against you," which people who do not understand take to mean you were found guilty. Your reputation suffers significantly.

(Yes, I am talking about the circumstances of a real case, not a hypothetical one.)

I'm

Care to share the jurisdiction and case number?

 

[boulderjohn]

I'm

Care to share the jurisdiction and case number?

Nope, because I don't want to open old wounds.

 

[boulderjohn]

Then sue the person who said that for slander. Then his insurance company can pay you a settlement and have the case dismissed with prejudice....

Any idea what you have to do to win a slander or libel case?

I am not an attorney, but as I understand the difference, if I am accused of violating the law and stand trial, the prosecution has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that I am guilty. If someone accuses me of something outside of the legal system and I sue for slander or libel, then I have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that I am not guilty, because they cannot be convicted if what they said is true or if they had a reasonable belief it was true.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Then sue the person who said that for slander. Then his insurance company can pay you a settlement and have the case dismissed with prejudice....

Is it slander, or just the usual misinformation that one commonly finds on the internet?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Lorenzoid]

John, I apologize if my attempt at humor hit a sore spot. I agree that the system by which meritless cases are routinely settled is flawed.

 

[KevinNM]

If someone accuses me of something outside of the legal system and I sue for slander or libel, then I have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that I am not guilty, because they cannot be convicted if what they said is true or if they had a reasonable belief it was true.

No, the burden of proof is on the accuser. They usually have to show via "preponderance of evidence" that what they claim is true. Sometimes it requires "clear and convincing evidence", which is a higher standard. Apparently, in very rare cases, it requires "beyond a reasonable doubt".

 

[kelemvor]

If the person said "was settled with prejudice against you," would that not be accurate? Just because the person hearing that doesn't really understand that it might not mean he did whatever it was doesn't mean the speaker was being dishonest. If I was boulderjohn I wouldn't be looking to sue, either.

An awful thing, our legal system today.

 

[stuartv]

once you offer to assist then you have a legal obligation to do so within the limits of your training.

I would not be surprised if a defendant's lawyer (i.e. the attorney for the charter operator - or the complainant's lawyer, for that matter) attempted to share the pain by claiming your display of a "pro" card was an implied offer to assist.

I was once refused service in Maui when I provided a NAUI Instructor card ... the man told me they only accepted PADI cards. I walked across the street and got on a boat with his competitor. Apparently business is so good in Maui that you can be that specific ...

Or maybe they don't want customers that know what they are doing going out with them and then posting about their experience on Trip Advisor...

 

[Diving Dubai]

I asked this very question of a couple of operators I've just dived with in Indonesia.

There answer was quite simple. They just use your cert and number of dives to gauge your experience as they put together the dive groups. After the first day (or twos ) diving they soon know who can dive and who can't (despite what the latter might think of themselves)

In 2 weeks with 24 guests I witnessed a DM who hadn't a clue about MOD, another DM who had to stand vertically on the sand to sort their problems out and an instructor who failed to check his air and found himself at 40 bar at 40mins (50 bar on boat and 1 hour dives was the standard) and had to be put on a spare octo.

I also witnessed a girl with 7 dives, just qualified who had near perfect trim, occasional only minor buoyancy problems, with air consumption equal to the guides

The moral it seems, is not how good you think you are or what your cert card and log book say, but how competent a diver you actually appear to be in the eyes of others.

 

[Neilwood]

Wow! That was a bizarre saga. Somehow I missed the original threads. It gives me pause to feel sad for you pro divers out there.

It should be noted the the instructor wasn't professional in respect that he didn't get paid. He was at the time a British Sub Aqua Club instructor (afaik he still is). One of the main issues with the situation he was in was a change in wording in the club insurance removing criminal liability cover which caused a big delay in the resolution of the situation