Where to start learning?

[PattyG]

Hi all....

I'm interested in learning about rebreathers. Can anyone suggest some good reading material for learning the principles behind this equipment?

Also...anyone heard of the Frog? I met these guys yesterday at a DIR Demo Day:
www.frogdiver.com

thanx for your input.......

 

[Dee]

Hey...Welcome to this side of the pond!

 

[PattyG]

I JUST discovered this board........quite a wealth of knowledge over here!

More learning......more fun.

 

[DrySuitDave]

Patty,

The Frog appears to be a constant flow SCR (semi-closed rebreather) which is similar in design to the Drager's that you see around.

Semi-closed circuit does not remotely have the gas effiiciency of a fully closed circuit unit like the Inspiration from Ambient Pressure or the Cis-Lunar, etc.

Attached is a picture of the Frog unit you spoke of. You can always go to the official Frog website here.

A better website on the Frog is Ron's Rebreather Page

Click here for a huge listing of rebreather web sites.

Padispro I believe is the moniker of one of our apparent rebreather experts here although we have a few more whose names escape me.

 

[padiscubapro]

Originally posted by DrySuitDave
Patty,

The Frog appears to be a constant flow SCR (semi-closed rebreather) which is similar in design to the Drager's that you see around.

Semi-closed circuit does not remotely have the gas effiiciency of a fully closed circuit unit like the Inspiration from Ambient Pressure or the Cis-Lunar, etc.

Attached is a picture of the Frog unit you spoke of. You can always go to the official Frog website here.

A better website on the Frog is Ron's Rebreather Page

Click here for a huge listing of rebreather web sites.

Padispro I believe is the moniker of one of our apparent rebreather experts here although we have a few more whose names escape me.

Dave,
Thanks for the plug....

Reading your latest posts I can see you are doing your homework!
The latest Ispiration death inquest that was released recently was one of the first 20 inspiration owners, The Uk papers are blasting the Inspiration but fail to properly tell people that the unit was warning the diver sometihing was wrong but he dove anyway after banging the handsets on a solid object to stop the beeping... From what I have heard the unit gave the "must calibrate" message and the diver was unable to get it to calibrate (probably had 1 cell out of range) he dove anyway and apparantly suffered an OTOX hit.. Someone else said he complained about bad contacts.. If thats the case, skip the first dive, clean the battery and cell holder contacts, and change the cell..... Don't ever dive with a must calibrate!!! I have dove with 1 dirty contact it reset the computer on entry (backroll) but seemd to be ok once in the water (it became the slave) I did the dive because I had 1 definately good computer and bailout, I just took it easy and cleaned the contacts between dives.. I would never dive with a bad sensor, just asking for trouble...

 

[PattyG]

Hi Dave, padiscubapro.....

I am just starting to look, and the Frog is a local product (good thing in my book). I can get to this guys house in a little over an hour if I need assistance, education or parts.

In his grand scheme, a person can start with the SCR, and add the electronics for a CCR (MK II) at a later date. I don't understand enough about it to form any type of opinion yet. But, if it's possible, it seems to be a good way to get started.

I've ordered a book called "Simple Guide to Rebreather Diving" by Steve Barsky. Any other references you can point me toward?

Must learn as much as I can.

 

[padiscubapro]

Originally posted by PattyG
Hi Dave, padiscubapro.....

I am just starting to look, and the Frog is a local product (good thing in my book). I can get to this guys house in a little over an hour if I need assistance, education or parts.

In his grand scheme, a person can start with the SCR, and add the electronics for a CCR (MK II) at a later date. I don't understand enough about it to form any type of opinion yet. But, if it's possible, it seems to be a good way to get started.

I've ordered a book called "Simple Guide to Rebreather Diving" by Steve Barsky. Any other references you can point me toward?

Must learn as much as I can.

In my opinion, no. If you are going to do a CCR do it from the start.. first an SCR may give you a bad taste about rebreathers and its just something else to unlearn..

using a CCR as an SCR is a skill to learn but it is different than rebreathers designed to operate as a full time SCR.

The frog in its CCR form was originally called the Gator an was going to be marketed exclusively by ANDI, There were many problems(I know of 1 instructor who passed out due to low O2) and ANDI dropped support and training, it was a mutual parting from what I understand.

Right now the only CCR thats affordable witha proven track record is the Inspiration, The prism has alot of promise.. I haven't seen a Megladon as of yet so I can't comment on its design..

I have over 200 hours dive time on my Inspiration down to 300 feet on trimix and about 210 on AIr... If you have solid training and follow it, I don't see any problems with the unit.. There are a few short commings that I would like to see changed but they are less annoying to me than the shortcommings I see in the prism.. There are alot of inspirations out there and APvalves has been around for some time so I don't think you will have problems getting parts or Service, just the turn around will be a little longer than if APD was in the US and at 6K or so delievered to the US its not a bad deal..


I do like the idea of NOT having an auto diluent addition, some people say its a shortcomming, but I see it as a blessing because I have full control of gas volume in the loop, sure its another skill to learn and a bit more work for people taking photos and video (I do both) but I like the idea of not having gas injected into a loop when I go head down to look into a hole or under a ledge..

There are only a handful of Inspiration trainers in the US, certs in the US can only be done by ANDI or IANTD, TDI does not endorse the Inspiration since there is no us distributor.

check out
http://www.ambientpressurediving.com/inspusa.html

Dave's instructor is the last one on the list.. I'm a few above him...

Joe

 

[padiscubapro]

Originally posted by PattyG
Hi Dave, padiscubapro.....

I am just starting to look, and the Frog is a local product (good thing in my book). I can get to this guys house in a little over an hour if I need assistance, education or parts.

In his grand scheme, a person can start with the SCR, and add the electronics for a CCR (MK II) at a later date. I don't understand enough about it to form any type of opinion yet. But, if it's possible, it seems to be a good way to get started.

I've ordered a book called "Simple Guide to Rebreather Diving" by Steve Barsky. Any other references you can point me toward?

Must learn as much as I can.

I forgot to mention, go to APD website and download their owners manual its a decent reference

http://www.ambientpressurediving.com/manual.html

I haven't read the book so I can't offer an opinion on it, but in my experience many people who write books aren't the best source of info since they generally aren't the real users.. Talk to the poeple who USE the units..

I wasn't hooked onto a CCR until I got really confortable(and experience) on the unit, now I will never go back.. Its also wonderful in COLD water breathing warm moist gas!
On oc doing a 1 hour dive in 35-40 degree water I start to get chilled, If I'm swimming about (on my ccr)I generally have to let some water into my hood to cool me off!

 

[Okiecaver]

Boy if yooze guyz only knew how much trouble my interest in the Inspiration has gotten me!

Untold horrors, death and dismemberment if I so much as gaze on one!

Regardless of that, I've pretty much decided to train on it in '04 so I can use one on my trip to Scapa Flow that year.

Patty G, you still want to go on that trip?

Padi, you've been a wealth of info on it. I'll continue to read up on it, and now that Sue Sharples and her buddy Steve are using them, I can check them out from time to time, so I'm not a complete strange to the unit.

Dive safe
Brock

 

[MikeFerrara]

Hey Brock,

Sue and Steve keep talking about how great side mount is but when ever you see them they have those Inspirations. Mine Lamotte would not seem so big if a guy had one of those and maybe a scooter.

So...it got you in trouble huh. The only trouble it will make for me is that my wife wants one. If it were only one for me, I would just get it but I have to get two.