When to take Advanced O/W Training???

[jeckyll]

I think the right answer is 'it depends'.

For myself, I had already purchased my own gear (including drysuit) and was at the point where my buoyancy with the drysuit was 'acceptable'. By no means good, but I was able to hold safety stops and had decent trim ... for someone new to diving and new to a drysuit. I went into the AOW course with 12 dives, 5 of which were drysuit dives, all in the previous month. Unfortunately I was the MOST experienced person in my class. I found the AOW too easy and wanted to be more challenged (we did PPB, deep, nav, wreck and night). Though I did enjoy the Nav component.

Just my $0.02.

Bjorn

 

[NJScubaDoc]

Take it ASAP in my opinion, just take it wherever you'll be doing your diving *most* of the time. If you are diving off NC all the time, then make sure you train off NC. If you are just a warm water wuss then head south!

 

[daniel f aleman]

I know you despise all things DIR, but this is a core skill that anyone who has passed DIR-F has mastered.

I'd have to give back skills to take a funndies course. When I was a kid we had buoyancy contests where we worked all kinds of positions: on our backs, head down, lotus, etc., as well as prone - all with no BC of any type. Just stating that that buoyancy in any position is to be mastered...

 

[StSomewhere]

Fair enough. Though if you can't do the above drills horizontally then the skills you might have to "give back" might not be the ones you'd be evaluated on.

The point for this thread is, its too bad that true buoyancy is not taught, even in a PPB class or AOW.

 

[TSandM]

I did AOW immediately after OW, simply because I felt too incompetent to get in the water without an instructor. There really wasn't very much in the way of new information or skills in my AOW, other than navigating a square (I did deep, nav, night, PPB and scooter dives). But it gave me five more dives.

AOW is very instructor-dependent. I have seen the syllabus for another AOW class which has quite a bit more "meat" to it.

My advice, if you need work on buoyancy, weighting and trim, is to talk to the shop that certified you. Find out if they have an e-group, or if they have some divemasters who would be willing to dive with you for a modest fee. Look into a local dive club, or use Scubaboard to see if you can find some experienced divers in your area who will do a dive or two to help you . . . I found my mentor here. You need experience, and you need some advice, but you don't necessarily need a formal class at this point.

I would differ with some of the prior posters . . . from my recent experience taking DIR-F with two relatively novice divers, I would NOT look at that as your next step. If you were interested in going in that direction, wait until your basic buoyancy and trim are pretty decent. Otherwise, you miss a lot of what the class has to offer, and it's a very frustrating experience.

 

[StSomewhere]

Lynne I understand what you're saying, but the problem is that newer divers need some sort of instruction to learn buoyancy, trim, and position. Yes, the DIR-F class is probably too much to take in at one shot for newer divers. But, basic buoyancy and trim isn't just going to happen, as if by magic. The skills are too counterintuitive for people to just pick up on their own by "just doing some dives". The integrated weight pockets of the BC their LDS will sell them will have them tilted out of trim at some partially vertical angle with fins dragging, they'll learn to fin to keep position, and they'll claim to have good buoyancy. The reality is that they have none of those skills. Every charter boat I've ever been on in Florida proves this point.

AG and JoeT at 5thd-x offer an excellent Essentials of DIR workshop, which is probably the better format for newer divers or the masses of recreational divers who just never learned proper technique. IMO, its worth a hundred PPB/AOW classes.

 

[TSandM]

StSomewhere, you're preaching to the choir, and I didn't advise just "doing some dives". I think one needs help and advice. I just don't think the things you are talking about will come out of the typical AOW course. You were very lucky to have access to Fifth DX and their new program, but the OP is in North Carolina, I believe, and doesn't. What does such a person do to try to learn buoyancy and trim? I think the best route is to find an experienced diver who understands such things and get some coaching. Anybody who is here on Scubaboard has access to a ton of written information extolling the virtues of learning correct weighting, buoyancy control, and trim -- such a person just needs some practical guidance in accomplishing what he already understands to be desirable. And a lot of instructors will give you a blank look AT BEST if you ask for such guidance.

 

[StSomewhere]

For the record, I flew from the Midwest out to Monterey for my Essentials class. I simply made it a priority.

 

[daniel f aleman]

Fair enough. Though if you can't do the above drills horizontally then the skills you might have to "give back" might not be the ones you'd be evaluated on.

The point for this thread is, its too bad that true buoyancy is not taught, even in a PPB class or AOW.

Buoyancy in the prone position is a given for a full cave diver, like yours truly. And, for the record, when diving, I'm the one doing the evaluating. :14:

 

[Rick Murchison]

I took AOW when I discovered there was such a thing, about 25 years after I'd started diving. It was a nice review of much but not all of the Scuba Diver course I'd taken originally. I was surprised basic deco diving wasn't covered, as it had been in my original course. On the other hand it did cover things that didn't exist for the original course, like BCs and Safe Seconds.
While I don't think waiting 25 years is needed, I do think a few dives under the belt is a good idea, and that SSI's 24 dive target is about right. Equally important, in my mind, is to dive on at least four or five occasions a year. By that I mean at least one or two dives every two to three months, not five dives in one week on vacation. And more is better.
Rick