When should you flunk a student

[baltimoron]

us seventeen year olds are not all like that... hahah

are you discriminating against the practicers of cannabis comsumption?!?! (just kidding)

 

[scuba_frog]

Gary, your comment about being consistant is so true. I stand corrected. Now that I think about it, that hold true to just about anything.

Actually last night I ran into one of the kids from my class that was having a difficult time. As it turned out, she did not pass the class with everyone else. She wound up being "tutored" by the instructor one on one until she mastered the required skills. Glad to see my club doesn't rubber stamp certifications. I have much more respect for the intructors and this student now that I know what happened.

 

[geraldp]

Last year when I took my OW test, there were a couple kids (and I do mean kids...10-13 yrs old) who could not do a couple of the required tests...mainly the BC and the weight belt removal and replacement. Yet, the instructor passed these kids and they are now junior OW divers. At what point do you say enough is enough and fail these people. Yes they paid their money, but they are risking their lives and the lives of whoever they dive with. I'm sorry, but to me, this is not the way to do things. Don't get me wrong, the intructors were excellent and they and the divemasters went above and beyond the call to assist people. But when do you hand out the "F". Just curious as to your opinions.

I took my SSI Stress & Rescue Open Water test last weekend. My instructor flunked half the students (2 of 4). The course consists of 4 hours of classroom/pool work, an open book exam (due at the start of the class) and a closed book exam. We all passed that portion. For our Open Water portion we had about a 500-yard snorkel/swim that we had to do within a certain amount of time, and one guy failed that. In fact I barely made it (at 47 apparently I'm not in the shape I used to be . As soon as the first two students got back from the swim they were told to go rescue an unconscious diver. One just sat there while the other did all the work. Later, after several other tests the instructor sent me out with him to do another unconscious diver rescue. I asked him if he wanted to lead or assist, and he responded "whatever". So I took charge and told him how to assist, which he did fine. The instructor failed him because he "didn't have the right attitude". He did all the other tests OK, so I feel kind of funny about that since he is my buddy. Maybe he was stressed and tired after the swim (which is intentionally part of the program), but so far he had always shown himself to me to be a fairly conscientious buddy. But it was the instructor’s call and I respect his decision.

Jerry

 

[baltimoron]

.... sounds like a hard test. i guess it has to be hard because either you can do this or you cant- it doesnt seem like there is much room for grey.

 

[Patch]

This is a great board ... with I had found it earlier.

Good topic also, since we are doing our last OW checkout dive tonight.

I am 55 and my wife is 52 and we are doing the classes with our granddaughter. First grandparent, grandbaby team for our instructor he says.

We told our instructor the first night, if Emily (grandbaby) doesn't have what it takes, cut her proto. Us too for that matter. I have been playing in water since birth, and my wife is pretty good too. Emily is fish ... can't get her out of our pool at home, but she is only 11.

I can't imagine a child taking the class alone, and if a parent is there, they should pull the plug if things are not going well.

I think attitute is everything. Another kid in our class, about 16, is a complete moron, and doesn't really give a sh_t. I would kick his little butt out first night if I was teaching.

Emily wants to learn, and is doing great. In this case I think extra time should be given if necessary before giving up. I don't want to dive if an expert thinks I am not qualified.

Being left handed and Swedish, I figured I would screw something up real quick, but our instructor says I am a natural. Wish we had done this 20 years ago.

John

 

[baltimoron]

hey hey hey!!!!! just beacuse you are left handed doesnt mean you are clumsy!!!! maybe those sweedish people didnt teach you to be proud of your left-handedness!!!!! be proud! LEFTIES ROCK! lol

 

[Avalanche]

i was certified 15 years ago when i was 13. I had to do everything that the adults in the class had to do, and more from what i remember. (the instructor was very skeptical at first). i took the class very seriously, and since i was taking it with my father, i certainly didn't want to make him look bad. I think that I was at a great age, any younger though is a tough call.

 

[scuba_frog]

I have no problem with younger kids taking the class. IMO, 10 or 11 is the youngest that should be included in an adult class. And yes, it is better if the parents are also taking the class, but I also think that it should be mandatory for the parents to stay with the kids while the class (both classroom and pool) is going on. One, because it is not a baby sitting sessions and two, because they will be able to see if the kid is capable of diving or if they even have an interest.

Let's face it, safety is the bottom line. If this is accomplished, the fun follows automatically.

 

[Diver0001]

I have no problem with younger kids taking the class. IMO, 10 or 11 is the youngest that should be included in an adult class. And yes, it is better if the parents are also taking the class, but I also think that it should be mandatory for the parents to stay with the kids while the class (both classroom and pool) is going on. One, because it is not a baby sitting sessions and two, because they will be able to see if the kid is capable of diving or if they even have an interest.

Let's face it, safety is the bottom line. If this is accomplished, the fun follows automatically.

I don't want to make any blanket statements about training 10 year olds but I've helped train a few young divers and what I've noticed is that there is a really big differnce between a 10 year old and a 12 year old--not so much in terms of waterskills but in terms of grasping the theory and awareness of risk.....especially that last bit.

It just gives me the heebie-jeebies when I see parents rushing their kids into a sport that can easily kill them. Sometimes parents aren't aware of the risks either.

R..

 

[garyfotodiver]

I have no problem with younger kids taking the class. IMO, 10 or 11 is the youngest that should be included in an adult class. And yes, it is better if the parents are also taking the class, but I also think that it should be mandatory for the parents to stay with the kids while the class (both classroom and pool) is going on. One, because it is not a baby sitting sessions and two, because they will be able to see if the kid is capable of diving or if they even have an interest.

Let's face it, safety is the bottom line. If this is accomplished, the fun follows automatically.

No, Dive training is not a baby-sitting service, but having a parent sitting in on the sessions is a bad idea. The child will not listen to the instructor, but will look to the parent. If the parent is in the water taking the training at the same time, the child will follow the parent's lead (if the parent listens and does) and both benefit.

Take the child to a discover scuba class if you want to find out if there is any interest or talent; many instructors will credit the cost against the price of the OW class.