What you dislike most....?

[Jim Lapenta]

a two year experation date on c basic openwater c cards unless the diver has advanced training or logs 25 or more dives and certfied dives only count if signed by dm or above this I believe we would support the lds and improve the quality of the rec diver

And what about the independently certified diver who has all their own gear and doesn't need an LDS except for fills? Or a DM for that matter as Bob stated. I train my students to not need DM's. And to never rely on them for anything other than directions.

 

[--tom--]

Quote:

Originally Posted by udtfire View Post
a two year experation date on c basic openwater c cards unless the diver has advanced training or logs 25 or more dives and certfied dives only count if signed by dm or above this I believe we would support the lds and improve the quality of the rec diver

And what about the independently certified diver who has all their own gear and doesn't need an LDS except for fills? Or a DM for that matter as Bob stated. I train my students to not need DM's. And to never rely on them for anything other than directions.

I think we are missing a great business opportunity. I will be happy to sign off your log book for the rebuild kit of a (fill in regulator make and model here). :cool2:

There seems to be a shift by some training organizations to get new divers to train in the tropics; establishing a corp of vacation only diving. I have a bit of an issue with that.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

There seems to be a shift by some training organizations to get new divers to train in the tropics; establishing a corp of vacation only diving. I have a bit of an issue with that.

I don't have an issue with that ... I think people benefit by having choices.

Referrals have been an option for as long as I've been diving ... one of the people in my initial OW class went that route, and for her it was a legitimate thing to do. She had no interest in local diving, so why should she be forced to learn in local conditions? Doing the academic and pool work ahead of time saves precious hours of your vacation. I think it's one of the choices that works well for a lot of people ... as long as they understand that doing so doesn't prepare them for diving in the colder climes they opted out of in the first place.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Maybe the discussion should move toward some other possible real problems with the dive industry?

I'd like to come back to this issue.

I think that the biggest real problem with the industry is one of perception. Who do the agencies and the manufacturers really serve? Who are their customers?

Is it the diver? Or is it, in fact, the dive shop? Seems to me that in most cases, it's the latter. Maybe that's a perception ... but in business, perception is at least as important as the reality. When people feel disconnected from the products and services they are spending money on, they build up a sense of resentment about the producers of those goods and services.

It's kinda like how most folks feel about their government ... "they don't really work for me".

Over the years I've purchased products that I've had issues with. If you buy enough stuff, that's eventually going to happen ... and in some ways it's an opportunity to find out more about the company you're buying it from. Some companies encourage direct correspondence with the end user. Others insist that you take your problems back to the store where you purchased the product. Guess which one I have an easier time doing business with? It isn't that the guy telling me to go back to the merchant is wrong, necessarily ... it's the perception that he doesn't care, or doesn't want to listen to me ... the guy whose money is helping make his business successful.

I had one equipment "manufacturer" tell me flat out that I wasn't his customer ... the dive shop was. OK ... fair enough ... then to my concern, his product can just stay right there on his "customer's" shelf ... I won't buy it. And if enough people feel that way, the merchant ... if not the vendor ... will eventually go out of business.

On the other hand, take a company like DUI. They make a pretty high-end product ... and if you dive in someplace like I do, you can damn well consider it "life support". But if I have a problem with my DUI suit, I can log onto their website and send them an email ... and I can count on getting an answer pretty quick. They treat me like the customer. I've got a dive light I paid $1200 for. If I have a problem with it I can pick up the phone and call the folks who built it ... and get my issues addressed promptly. I've got a $1700 dive computer. The one time it acted up on me I sent out an email and had a repair ticket within an hour. I'll continue buying products from all those people.

Try doing that with some of the big manufacturers ... they won't talk to you. Perhaps they have legitimate reasons why not ... but that isolation from the end user sends a message ... a perception ... which is, to my concern, THE reason why so many people don't view them as the best choice for their purchases. To be fair, not all big companies are like that. I once posted a question on ScubaBoard about my Sea & Sea strobe ... and within minutes I had a PM from someone at Sea & Sea giving me a phone number and asking me to call him. That dude made a customer for life ... because he connected ... he treated me like my business was important to him ... and so it became important to me.

You know the old adage ... well, maybe the customer isn't always right ... but the customer always has to at least feel like their concerns matter. Because it's their money that ultimately keeps these people in business. A dive shop can purchase tens of thousand$ worth of gear, but unless people like you and me buy it, it's worthless.

So that's what the real issue is, as I see it. It's not that Company X won't let me work on my own regulator ... it's that they won't listen to what matters to me. They don't care what I think. And as the end-user ... the guy whose money ultimately drives their business ... I see that as a problem ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[scubadada]

I love diving, I like the majority of people I dive with, a few of them, however, drive me nuts.

Good diving, Craig

 

[HowardE]

To be fair, not all big companies are like that. I once posted a question on ScubaBoard about my Sea & Sea strobe ... and within minutes I had a PM from someone at Sea & Sea giving me a phone number and asking me to call him. That dude made a customer for life ... because he connected ... he treated me like my business was important to him ... and so it became important to me.

Yes. ScubaBoard is truly a great way for divers to communicate directly with manufacturers. There are actually more than 50 equipment manufacturers with Q&A Forums on SB, and that number grows all the time. Even most of the big companies have Q&A forums, and as of today... that now that includes Aqua Lung and Apeks. I can't think of too many other industries where the manufacturing wing is so concerned about connecting with their end users that they'd participate in public forums like this.

I think that the agencies and the manufacturers of gear serve both the divers and the dive shops (even though sometimes its hard to see that). I also think (as i've said before) that too many dive shops just don't get the whole "Business" thing though... Most if not all of the people I know in the industry are in fact divers, and have found their way into the industry because of their love for and passion towards diving.

 

[LandoCalarusso]

wow... NWGratefuldiver, and howardE, and all the rest.... Thank you all for such great advice and conversation. Its seems yall have a great grasp on the industry, and I hope that the replies you have shared will help me in the future with not only my customers and students, but also the manufacturers. I hope that one day you all could come to my facility and feel as welcome here as your own home.... To all the divers out there, I look foreward to providing the best service I possibly can to meet all of your needs.

See ya down there!

 

[jrwalsh20]

I dislike most people that come on a charter boat talking up their skills and where they have dove all over the planet. very classless, just get on the boat and have fun, no one really cares about all of your skills aor where you have been. With that said it is always fun to converse on the boat about diving, just dont be a know it all.

 

[fjpatrum]

a two year experation date on c basic openwater c cards unless the diver has advanced training or logs 25 or more dives and certfied dives only count if signed by dm or above this I believe we would support the lds and improve the quality of the rec diver

I think you'd find it just made a new market in "black market" diving rather than improving the quality of rec divers. I would never bother diving as part of that industry. I'd rather spend the money on my own fill station and dive whenever, and wherever I want with whomever I want.

 

[treidm]

I am wondering what divers dislike most about the diving industry in general. What changes would people like to see or have, to better serve our fellow divers, employees, and instructors? (Charter boats, dive shops, internet, tank fills, classes, or any other services people would perfer)

Please give any feedback or ideas that you would like to offer...

Price of tank fills
Training: Min standards raised, classes extended
Price & availability of reg repair kits
DS to DS friendly full service treatment: Shouldn't matter where you bought gear
No more high pressure "threatening you" sales
Over-selling "trinket products", to novice beginning divers, that are not needed
Hot Chick employees! J/K