Info What is the "best" fin?

Please register or login

Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

Benefits of registering include

  • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
  • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
  • You can make this box go away

Joining is quick and easy. Log in or Register now!

tursiops

Marine Scientist and Master Instructor (retired)
ScubaBoard Supporter
Scuba Instructor
Messages
18,413
Reaction score
19,016
Location
U.S. East Coast
# of dives
2500 - 4999
I have been intrigued by the Force Fin Blog post linked in A surprise ... and elsewhere.
It claims to prove that Force Fins were more efficient than other fins, based on tests run by the “University of Buffalo,” and sponsored by the “US Department of Naval Research.” It presents the following graph:
1671574303843.png
After reading this, my questions (and some initial answers) were:
  • Department of Naval Research?
    • There is no such organization. What is meant is the Office of Naval Research (ONR).
  • What is “efficiency?”
    • Less oxygen used means more efficient…i.e., if a particular speed can be obtained with a fin but using less oxygen, then that fin is more “efficient” than a fin using more oxygen
  • What are fins “A” and “F”?
  • What does the graph actually show?
    • The graph relates oxygen uptake to speed of swimming. For reference, a typical speed of scuba swimmers is about 10-30m/min. Based on this graph, the blog concludes: “…they burned less air when wearing Force Fins.” That is not obvious from the graph; at slow speeds (30m/min), three fins required the same oxygen uptake, and the Force Fin Pro required more oxygen, thus was less efficient. At even slower (untested) speeds, the graph looks like all fins would be about the same. The lab tests were designed to see how fins performed at maximal speeds and exertion levels; at the highest speed they all performed about the same, although the Force Fin Pro was marginally (but not statistically) better.
    • The text in the blog, from ONR, said: “There were no statistically significant differences between the energy cost of the four fins at any of the investigated speeds.” It is not clear how the blog assertion is justified by this graph.
  • How do you relate VO2/min to RMV?
    • Note that a breath of air contains 21% O2, and not all that O2 is utilized before the exhalation. If it were all used, then VE (volume of exhalation) would be about 5 times VO2. However, the exhaled air typically still contains about 16% O2 (this is why CPR rescue breathing can be helpful), so in practice VE/VO2 is at least 20, often expressed in the exercise literature as 25-30 for moderate-to-intense exercise. Thus, VO2/min = 1.3 l/min on the graph is at least VE=26 l/min. In Imperial units this RMV is about 0.92 cuft/min.
  • Has this work been published anywhere, or does it only exist as a Freedom-of-Information-Act request and response?
    • According to the blog, the work was done prior to May 1993. In 1996, Pendergast, Tedesco, Nawrocki, and Fischer published “Energetics of underwater swimming with SCUBA” In Medicine & Science in Sports & Exercise, Vot 28, p573-580. It is attached to this post. The work -- acknowledged as having been funded by a grant from ONR -- was submitted for publication in 1994, for work over the span of a four-year grant, presumably 1991-1994, or perhaps 1990-1993. A later publication in 2003 (also attached) by Pendergast, Mollendorf, Logue, and Samimy, “Evaluation of fins used in underwater swimming” in Undersea & Hyperbaric medicine, vol 30, No 1, p55-71, had a more appropriate title and content, but was acknowledged as having been supported by the US Navy, NAVSEA, Experimental Diving Unit, not ONR; it does reference the 1996 work but apparently used similar methodology and some of the same data.
Nowhere is the 1996 or the 2003 publications – or elsewhere that I can find – is the figure above that purports to show that Force Fins are better than other fins. It may simply be that the figure was deemed to be wrong or irrelevant.

What the 1996 and the 2003 reports DO say and focus on, plus other works cited, are the following points:
  • Effectively ALL tests (and in earlier work) are for the flutter kick.
  • Previous studies have shown:
    • a VO2/min of about 0.8 l/min at 15m/min, increasing with speed up to 2.5 l/min at 30 m/min. [Note that 0.8 l/min corresponds to an RMV of roughly 16 l/m (0.56 cuft/min), so seems quite reasonable.]
    • The fin surface area is inversely related to the VO2/min, and maximal swimming speed is directly related to fin flexibility.
  • The 1996 study looked at oxygen uptake of male divers versus fin types, normalized to distance travelled. “There were no significant differences in fin type across all subjects, however the values varied from 43 to 54 l/km. Fins with vents (A-V and B-V) were not significantly different for the same fin without vents (A and B).”
1671573305684.png
  • The fins A-H were not identified as to manufacturer or type, but the characteristics of the fins were given as:
1671573367093.png
Fin D, for example, was the lightest fin tested, was deemed flexible, has the smallest surface area, and had no vents. Fin H was medium weight, flexible, relatively large, and had no vents; it was jiddle-of-the=-road in the performance plot. Fin B-V, which had the lowest oxygen uptake measured, was one of the heavier fins, moderate flexibility, a medium surface area, and had vents. The “worst” fin for energy requirements was Fin F, which was light weight, moderately flexible, one of the two largest surface areas, and had vents. No pattern for “best” is discernable.​
  • I speculate that Fins A and F in the chart, and in the figure immediately above, are the same A and F that are plotted in the top figure on this post. If so, Fin A is a middle of the road performer, and Fin F is the worst….but they are not statistically different.
  • VO2/min is not affected by depth, so long as the swimmer is not right at the surface or the bottom.
  • “It has also been shown that the energy cost of swimming was negatively correlated with fin surface area, but not flexibility, while maximal speed was negatively correlated with flexibility.”
  • Fin selection affects VO2/min by as much as 25%, “with large heavy ridged fins requiring the highest VO2/min.”
  • “A firm conclusion about the best types of fins cannot be made from previous studies, and many new fins designs have been marketed based on various physical characteristics without supportive data.”

  • The best indicator of a fin’s performance (in terms of energy efficiency) is the kick frequency;
  • The figure plots the kick frequency versus the Energy cost (joules per meter per kg), which says for a given body weight, the swimmer uses more energy to go the same distance if they kick faster (and takes less time to get there). The legend is for Barefoot (BF), a long, stiff fin (like the Mares Attack; LS)), a short flexible fin (like the Apollo Bio-Fin Pro SF), and a Monofin Finis (MF).
1671573473804.png
  • There is an interplay between kick frequency and the depth of the kick; large, slow kicks each produce much thrust but not very often. Fast, small kicks each produce only a little thrust, but very often; it would seem that the effects have similar energy needs in terms of total thrust produced, but it doesn’t work out that way.
  • The propelling efficiency is the ratio of the useful mechanical power, i.e. useful propulsion, to the overall mechanical power produced by the swimmer; it is higher for the acceleration of a large mass of water to a small speed, than it is for a small mass of water accelerated to a high speed. [This is why ship’s propellers are very large and turn slowly…]

(to be continued)
 

Attachments

  • 1671573555023.png
    1671573555023.png
    51.7 KB · Views: 88
  • 1671574215721.png
    1671574215721.png
    45.1 KB · Views: 92
  • 1671574257355.png
    1671574257355.png
    38 KB · Views: 104
  • Moller et al - EANX and exercise - 2022.pdf
    469.6 KB · Views: 90
  • Energetics of underwater swimming with SCUBA.pdf
    589.7 KB · Views: 72
  • Zamparo et al - fins.pdf
    272.7 KB · Views: 87
  • Pendergast etc all - Fins Evaluaton.pdf
    961.3 KB · Views: 78
(continued)
What does all this mean? For flutter kicking….
  • Smaller, lighter, more flexible fins are less work and only slightly less effective in moving you through the water.
  • The biggest determinate in the energy cost of swimming with fins is your body drag, not your fin type.
  • If you want to conserve gas, slow down; sustained speed while swimming is a major factor in energy usage.
  • If you want to work at the extremes – highest speed possible for as long as possible, or to go as far as possible in a given time – then fin type matters, but only a little…unless you move to a monofin, in which case the performance is much better than any pair of single-foot fin.
For frog kicking…

Not really studied.

One interesting result from all this poking around:

One paper (Möller, 2022; attached) found that use of Nitrox was advantageous; less ventilation (RMV) was required for high-intensity fin-swimming using 40% Nitrox.

(For reference in looking at the figure, 20 l/min is 0.7 cuft/min.]


Final Remarks:

In trying to understand the top plot of this post (the one from the blog and ostensibly from ONR), I finally decided to ask the senior author (now retired) of the studies, David Pendergast. He was kind enough to responds to my inquiries; here are some excepts from his emails to me:

“I did find one presentation with data from these experiments. They list the fins used and the energy cost of swimming with them as a function of velocity. I am attaching the graphs. In general the fins with the highest energy cost generated the most power, however the power is dissipated during the recovery [part of the kick cycle] and thus no real advantage in the function as well.”​
I asked him about the efficiency graph in the Force Fin blog post:

“I have never seen the graph you sent. I never gave them these data and did not give them permission to use it. If you look at the data in the graphs I sent or in the papers (where the raw data are) you can seen that their graph does not agree. Also the format of the graph is nothing we would have used.​
In regards to the data in the graph. The energy cost of swimming is determined by the body drag and the net mechanical efficiency. At low speeds swimming underwater with fins the drag is dominated by form drag, and is not influenced by wave drag. Form drag increases linearly with speed, whereas wave increases with the square. The linearity of the data is due to the drag being form. For the efficiency, this is pretty constant with fins underwater and thus the drag is the main determinant of the energy cost as shown by the data. The data are shown as a regression as to show mean and SD would not allow comparison of the fins due to the variability among both male and female subjects. Again the raw data (mean and SD) are in the original paper.​
For the difference between men and women, women have smaller shells and also generally less dense mass below the center of the body's mass. This means that the men have greater torque and body angle thus greater form drag. The difference in the max velocity is that women have much lower maximal aerobic power.”​

My conclusion:

The blog post that piqued my interest is either fiction or misrepresentation or severe misunderstanding. It was not worth my time to try and decipher…except that it led me down a rather interesting rabbit hole that concludes that -- if you are flutter kicking -- use whatever fin you like; if you go at slow to moderate speeds it won’t make any difference how much energy you use….your own body’s form drag is the biggest determinate of your energy usage. If you want to go as fast as possible, and your leg strength can support it, then large stiff blades are the “best.’ If you want to kick for as long a possible (i.e., go as far as possible), then you are better off with a more flexible, smaller fin, to use less energy per kick, and don't go fast.
 
I have been intrigued by the Force Fin Blog post linked in A surprise ... and elsewhere.
It claims to prove that Force Fins were more efficient than other fins, based on tests run by the “University of Buffalo,” and sponsored by the “US Department of Naval Research.” It presents the following graph:

  • Department of Naval Research?
    • There is no such organization. What is meant is the Office of Naval Research (ONR).
It is an organization, associated with U.N.C.L.E. -- the less you know, the better . . .
 
It is an organization, associated with U.N.C.L.E. -- the less you know, the better . . .
Since I worked for ONR for 15 years, I know you are joking.
 
Roger has a pair of Force Fins. He loves them for travel ONLY if we're going somewhere there's no/little current. They pack well. He doesn't feel they displace a lot of water, so he doesn't get a lot of propulsion. He also can't do a frog kick - so this is one of those 'results may vary depending on finning style'.
 
(continued)
What does all this mean? For flutter kicking….
  • The biggest determinate in the energy cost of swimming with fins is your body drag, not your fin type.

I can't agree with this point. I have probably half a dozen fins and they make a HUGE difference. The first fins I bought were the ScubaPro Go Sport fins. They were ok when I started and didn't know any better. Once I started diving with doubles they provided almost no propulsion. I switched to Apeks RK3's as my standard tech fin, but for serious propulsion I have a set of Hollis F1 fins, which are stiff as a board.

The fins, IMO make a huge difference. Unless I misunderstood the point or took it out of context?
 
What is the typical speed with which divers move/swim during a typical dive? I think that needs to be determined, and then it would seem, that if one is worried about efficiency, then it should be compared at this speed (or some narrow range).

Having the ability to swim fast for short, high intensity bursts may also be important to certain divers in particular situations, but if typical divers spend 95% of their time moving much slower, top end speed does not seem that relevant.

Also critical to determining the best fin is comfort and fatigue (or rather avoidance of fatigue) under a sustained swimming duration.

I know from personal experience that in order to "cruise' at a decent speed, the type of fins makes a huge difference. They are not at all equal.

I think a decent test of efficiency might be to compare how far a diver can swim on one breath.
 
If you want to go as fast as possible, and your leg strength can support it, then large stiff blades are the “best.’

Once I started diving with doubles they provided almost no propulsion. I switched to Apeks RK3's as my standard tech fin, but for serious propulsion I have a set of Hollis F1 fins, which are stiff as a board.

The fins, IMO make a huge difference.
Maybe these 2 things need to be taken together? Perhaps stiff fins offer more power conditional upon more powerful legs, and then the question becomes at just what point of leg strength and physical fitness does that advantage become evident. Put another way, perhaps they make a huge difference for some but not others?

-- if you are flutter kicking -- use whatever fin you like;

That's an important 'if.'

One point from past threads I didn't notice skimming this one is that in the past it's been claimed split fins can be easier on the knees (IIRC) of some divers. That wasn't an issue of finning power, so much as where the strain of finning was brought to bear on the body. I don't know how valid the idea is, but I have seen it brought up before, and it may be of interest to some.

Another thing that impacts fin choice is buoyancy. I'm not a drysuit diver and tend to be foot heavy, so I like neutral or mildly positively buoyant fins - hence I dive Deep 6 Eddys (with big foot pockets for my size 15 feet), and OMS Slipstreams are very similar (with smaller foot pockets).

I've seen people with wider skills than mine talk about how a given fin does for frog kicking or back kicking before, or even flutter kicking (e.g.: such as into current). People doing penetration dives may value maneuverability in tight spaces.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/perdix-ai/

Back
Top Bottom