Weekend OW class. Pool

[DeepSeaDan]

I cant really shorten this but basically a student panicked at 14' with a simulated OOA trying to use a buddy Octo.

This is a weekend OW class and today (4-2-2005) was the first day in the water. There is a couple, myself, and 2 others. The male in the couple was having difficulties such as dumping all the air in his BC, hitting the bottom, and fully inflating his BC corking back to the surface. Amusing to watch but still had me concerned. His mask was always full of water because he would blow as hard as possible through his nose trying to clear (like sneezing). Anyway he was having some trouble.

Where it got hairy was during OOA drills. The instructor was right next to the "buddys" while each pair did it separately, and everyone else just sat watching. Well it was the male in the couples turn to recieve air from his buddy (his GF). So he tossed his reg and waited, and waited, and waited, while his GF couldn't get her octo to him. So he waited until he was completly out of breath and struggled to surface from 14'. He didn't ditch any weight, didn't inflate his BC, didn't try to get either of his regulators, didn't grab the instructors octo which was about 6" from his face. I am suprised he made it to the top.

He came back down and "she" found her octo this time and got it to him without another incident.

Another interesting thing he did was purge his reg 2 times (phhh...phhh) before he stuck it in his mouth..... at the bottom of the pool.?.?.? (not once but everytime)

So I guess lesson learned is to not wait until the stuff hits the fan and your reacting rather than acting. And you have to help yourself too.

BTW, I am a student in the class.

I'd find another class.

#1 - Watching this fellow struggle to valsalva & decend / ascend uncontrolably is not what should be considered "amusing" - the Instructor or an Assistant should have been working with this fellow one-on-one to correct these problems the moment they were observed.

#2 - I am astounded the Instructor would sit & watch this man wait for air until he could wait no longer before intervening. Did he even attempt to control the man's bolt for the surface?

#3 - Repeated purging of a regulator by a student is a good sign that they are stressed.

#4, and most importantly...PEOPLE CAN DIE IN POOLS!

Myself and another Instructor were working in a 10' pool with seperate groups of students when one of his charges bolted during an interupted air-share drill. The first I knew of it was when I surfaced my group to see my associate hurrying over to me to report the incident. He had the boy ( he was 17 ) on O2. He said he was complaining of severe headache & pain in his mid-sternal area. I exited the pool, leaving my buddy to secure the students, & assessed the student ( I am an EMT / DMT ). To be brief, I ordered up an ambulance & accompanied the lad to the local emerg. ( this on the advice of a hyperbaric physician @ the local chamber facility, whom I consulted by phone. I wanted him shipped straight to the chamber, but the Doctor wanted him assessed by an emrg. Dr. 1st...). After insuring the on call Dr. was up to speed on diving-related emergencies, I returned to the pool. Later that evening the boy's Father called me to inform me that his son was being treated for an embolism in the chamber! He recovered with complete resolution of symptoms.

Indeed, the pool can be a dangerous place. Any Instructor who believes otherwise best reconsider.

Regards,
D.S.D.

 

[jeffreyd]

I'd find another class.

#1 - Watching this fellow struggle to valsalva & decend / ascend uncontrolably is not what should be considered "amusing" - the Instructor or an Assistant should have been working with this fellow one-on-one to correct these problems the moment they were observed.
He was physically fine throughout the whole up and down part. And each "trip" was about a minute or two. He got it down after 3 "trips."

#2 - I am astounded the Instructor would sit & watch this man wait for air until he could wait no longer before intervening. Did he even attempt to control the man's bolt for the surface?
Everything looked like it was going to be ok. I saw her give him the octo and I felt relieved until I saw him bolt. Yes the instructor tried to slow him down to prevent an embolisim. The instrictor also followed him up and was with him within 30 seconds of breaking the surface. (remember we were at 14ffw)

#3 - Repeated purging of a regulator by a student is a good sign that they are stressed.
I believe he got confused with the part about purging the regulator when setting up the gear with, purge before you use the reg.

#4, and most importantly...PEOPLE CAN DIE IN POOLS!
Unfortunatly
.

I was trying to lighten the story. But apparently it came off as bashing him.

 

[jbd]

At first I thought the BC was to help going up, but I only know now that it should get you neutral and you swim up.

The BC is what takes you up. Its all based on Boyle's law. Once you truly understand buoyancy and its control you will find that you don't swim up. Swimming up will most likely create an ascent rate faster than the preferred 30 feet per minute.

 

[jeffreyd]

The BC is what takes you up. Its all based on Boyle's law. Once you truly understand buoyancy and its control you will find that you don't swim up. Swimming up will most likely create an ascent rate faster than the preferred 30 feet per minute.

Ok by swim I meant lightly fin. I know boyles law like the back of my hand. (for reasons other than diving)

But theoretically the best way to ascend would be to stay neutral no matter the depth. Which is why we vent air as we ascend. Or do you want to stay slightly positive and go along for the ride until you need to stop and vent more to get neutral.

I'd rather stay neutral all the time.

 

[jbd]

Ok by swim I meant lightly fin. I know boyles law like the back of my hand. (for reasons other than diving)

But theoretically the best way to ascend would be to stay neutral no matter the depth. Which is why we vent air as we ascend. Or do you want to stay slightly positive and go along for the ride until you need to stop and vent more to get neutral.

I'd rather stay neutral all the time.

With your knowledge of Boyle's law, you probably understand that there is no reason to fin at all to initiate an ascent or descent for that matter. By applying Boyle's law you can ascend withot any hand/arm or leg movement. Assuming you are neutrally buoyant at any particular depth all that is needed is to make yourself very slightly positively buoyant. Once this happens you will ascend. If the expanding air is not released from the BC the rate of ascent will increase and eventually become uncontrollable. The key to a nice controlled motionless ascent is to keep yourself just very slightly positive with the ability to stop at any depth you so desire to stop at.

With proper technique this(starting & stopping the ascent) can be done with breathing control.

If you are truly neutral then you will be stationary in the vertical water column. If you are vertical and finning lightly you will be positively buoyant(assuming neutral buoyancy to begin with) compliments of Boyle's law.

 

[Ayisha]

These are all good points:

1. The instructor could have reacted a little faster.
2. The student shouldn't have moved on to OOA's until he was comfortable with his basic equipment/skills.
3. Use caution in the way you use your BC. Whether you inflate your BC slightly at depth to start your ascent (Naui?) or kick slowly to start (PADI?), ensure that it is a controlled, slow ascent. Either way, the air in the BC will start expanding, and you will need to release air to maintain a slow ascent.
Likewise, when you are descending, you control your descent by adding a little air throughout your descent so that you don't freefall, and cause damage below or hurt your ears.
4. If your buddy cannot get the octo for you, get it yourself.

Some other points:

I was taught that in an OOA emergency, we signal that we need the octo, and then we take it ourselves. If we're the donor, and the victim is having trouble getting it, then the donor helps. This was reiterated in the Rescue class.

5. Do not remove your regulator until you have the alternate air source in your hand, by your mouth! Then you can exchange the regs.

6. You guys are lucky that you do not dive in extremely cold water/ice dive. Purging the reg before putting it in your mouth is not only unnecessary but can cause your reg to freeze up in very cold conditions ie) freeflow.

jeffreyd, your powers of observation are already very good. This will serve you well. In order for you to be that aware of what was going on around you, you must have been very comfortable, and not distracted by your own issues. Great start!

 

[japan-diver]

3. Use caution in the way you use your BC. Whether you inflate your BC slightly at depth to start your ascent (Naui?) or kick slowly to start (PADI?), ensure that it is a controlled, slow ascent. Either way, the air in the BC will start expanding, and you will need to release air to maintain a slow ascent.
Likewise, when you are descending, you control your descent by adding a little air throughout your descent so that you don't freefall, and cause damage below or hurt your ears.

NAUI does not teach slightly inflating the BC to start an ascent, I have seen individual instructors from different agencies teach this but I don't agree at all. Slow kick to start ascent venting air to control rate as you ascend.( I am a NAUI Course Director)

Not seeing the class I can't really comment on the instructor. People bouncing a bit to start the class in the pool happens, thats why we use the pool. Possiblly sounds like he/she could have been a little closer so the student didn't bolt or could have been controlled. It sounds like possibly they moved from shallow to deep a little quick before everyone was comfortable with all skills. Instructors and divers alike must realize that the deep end of the pool can be dangerous and all cautions that we use in the ocean must be used in the pool.

 

[Stirling]

NAUI does not teach slightly inflating the BC to start an ascent, I have seen individual instructors from different agencies teach this but I don't agree at all. Slow kick to start ascent venting air to control rate as you ascend.( I am a NAUI Course Director)

Not seeing the class I can't really comment on the instructor. People bouncing a bit to start the class in the pool happens, thats why we use the pool. Possiblly sounds like he/she could have been a little closer so the student didn't bolt or could have been controlled. It sounds like possibly they moved from shallow to deep a little quick before everyone was comfortable with all skills. Instructors and divers alike must realize that the deep end of the pool can be dangerous and all cautions that we use in the ocean must be used in the pool.

I also don't see how anybody can make judgments about the class or instructor without actually being there to see what happened - stuff like this will happen with beginning students no matter how closely they are watched and no matter how good the instructor may be.

I also didn't get the part about using the BC to ascend; it wasn't clear to me exactly what was being described, but that isn't what I was taught and I don't think it is safe for beginning divers (who often can't be trusted to remember which is the inflate and which is the dump button on the power inflator). When I want to ascend vertically (as opposed to a gradual climb along a horizontal slope), I *swim* up, and very slowly. That may be a holdover habit from the days before BCs, but that is what I have always done. And I think I have much better control of my rate of ascent from dumping air and swimming up already negative than I would allowing the BC to carry me up and having to dump air to slow down.

On edit: If I stop finning, I immediately stop and will generally begin to sink again if I don't resume some movement with the fins. I might try to stay only slightly negative, but I would never get positive while ascending.

 

[DeepSeaDan]

...I may have been out of line by infering the Instructor in question was inadequate, and no, I wasn't there to observe first hand. The original post's tone, IMO, suggested a lack of sufficient control by the Instructor.

I have observed too many Instructors who demonstrate an almost cavalier approach to diving instruction. This is often the result of the person receiving an Instructors ticket long before they have gained the real world experience necessary to imbue in themselves the humbling respect & cautionary, conservative mindset so necessary for safe diving instruction. Someone sold them on the concept that diving is as easy as walking and that class should be LOADS OF FUN!! Well, yes, have fun by all means, but temper it with proper student attitude construction.

My apologies to the Instructor if he/she is not of the aformentioned ilk.

Regards,
D.S.D.

 

[Ayisha]

The BC is what takes you up. Its all based on Boyle's law. Once you truly understand buoyancy and its control you will find that you don't swim up. Swimming up will most likely create an ascent rate faster than the preferred 30 feet per minute.

This and the other posts by JBD are what I was referring to. JBD is apparently a NAUI instructor and Buoyancy control specialist. That's why I put a question mark after NAUI in my earlier post. Not sure if that is a NAUI thing or individual instructor thing. I know that with PADI, I was taught to swim up.

I recognized that in the posts above, it could seem confusing to a new diver and that it was ok to use the BCD like an elevator. That's why I put that it doesn't matter which method you use, as long as you have a controlled, slow ascent.

Perhaps JBD can explain his approach a little more?