VIP & Hydro Date Relationship

[SparticleBrane]

Not sure if this applies to the above-mentioned cylinders, but...

The recommended VIP schedule is based on the frequency of cylinder usage. I don't have the specific recommended schedule in front of me, but once a year VIPs applies only to cylinders that are used infrequently. Well used cylinders at dive shops, for example, should get a VIP several times each year.

There's no law, that's just the recommendation....

Yeah I understand -- just wondering if there was a specific reason for those specific cylinders.

Personally whenever I get my VIP cert and a good light, I wouldn't mind opening up my own cylinders every now and then. But for now they'll have to stay closed and only opened when needed.

 

[Doc Harry]

Yeah I understand -- just wondering if there was a specific reason for those specific cylinders.

I thought that's what you may have meant...

 

[drdaddy]

You're kidding, aren't you? They made you get a hydro early to bring the hydro timing in step with the VIP sticker?

If so that is so stupid that the mind boggles. The hydro is a requirement under federal law. The VIP is an informal "community standard" with no official rules or legal force. Please tell me you are joking or that I have misunderstood.

That is just nonsense about "keeping track". You get a hydro when the hydro expires. You get a visual when the visual expires. There is no requirement that you jump through hoops to keep them in some sort of synch. If its a headache, its because you are letting idiots bash you on the head!

I suppose that I could have got my vis at that time, but then I would have to leave it a the dive shop for the hydro later in the year. The headache is that there is not a LDS in the town I live and more often than not I cannot get my tanks serviced the same time I am down there (1 hour away). And then when I do go diving, I do not want the air station (not a shop that can vis or hydro) to deny me air - so the headache is trying to get everything in synch.

But as I said and my point was - my LDS and the local air stations will not fill if you need either a vis or hydro.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

Here's how my LDS handled the situation with me. When I brought a tank in for a vis they noticed that my hydro was due in less than a year so they told me I needed a hydro. I got the hydro. In 5 years the hydro and vis will be the same date (if I get my tanks "vis"ed on time).

A better way to handle it is for the shop to point out the looming need for a hydro test and then let you decide to do it then (if it is convenient) and if not to give you a VIP with the sticker punched to expire at the same time as the current hydro test.

In terms of managing hydro tests and VIP's, my preference is to have them come due in the off season where I won't miss the tanks if they are off getting hydro tested, inspected and filled for a few weeks.

Also, when you get a hydro test, it is an ideal time to replace the burst disc(s) in the valve or manifold as most will be at increased of failure due to age, corrosion and numbers of cycles if not replaced every 5 years or so.

 

[PR_SMITH]

To me it makes sense to have the VIs and Hydro in sync. I just took my doubles in for for both, since my current Vis expires Jan 2009, my hydro expires Aug 2009. Figured I might as well get 'em done together, both for convenience and to move the hydro date away away from the summer dive season.

As for the question of whether or not the DOT really has any jurisdiction, IMO, if you kept your tanks, say, at a beach hut, filled from your own compressor and dragged them down the beach and dove them(no boat involved), then maybe it's none of their business. But, if you choose to transport them, by car boat, etc., then DeptOfTransport does have a say. YMMV.

Question: does have the hydro done require that the tanks be 02 cleaned in order to continue the use of nitrox?

 

[DA Aquamaster]

The DOT's jurisdiction only applies to interstate commerce (they used to be the Interstate Commerce Commission), so unless the tanks being filled are used in interstate commerce, DOT has no jurisdiction over them.

The DOT has in the past ruled that they get to have a say in tanks that may potentially be used in interstate commerce however, so if it is portalble and capable of being transported out of state or used in commerce, they could potentially cite a fill station for filling one that is out of hydro.

So that pretty much leaves privately owned tanks filled from privately owned compressors that are not transported across state lines exempt from a hydro inspection.

-----

Practically speaking, if I am standing next to my personal tank filling it offf my personal compressor, I still want to know it has passed hydro in the last 5 years and has been inspected recently.

----

There is no telling what may have contaminated the tank in terms of hydrocarbons during the hydro test process, so hydro testing will require new O2 cleaning if you need to have an O2 clean tank.

That said, if you are using banked mixes, continuous blending or any method other than partial pressure blending, where O2 over 40% ever enters the tank, no special O2 cleaning is required - although an amazing number of shops require it, mostly as a revenue source.

Even with mixes over 40%, having an O2 clean valve is more critical than having an O2 clean tank as that is where the heating occurs.

-----

Personally, I tumble my tanks after they are hydro tested as they tend to come back with flash rust that I prefer to remove, especially in a tank that needs to be O2 clean. At that point O2 cleaning is just another step in the process and takes maybe 5 minutes longer to do.

 

[PR_SMITH]

Thanks for the info

What would a typical O2 cleaning cost?

 

[DA Aquamaster]

Locally, shops charge about $50 for an initial O2 cleaning on a single tank and one of the local shops charges half that for subsequent cleanings the following years.

Doubles are twice that plus a $25 disassembly/assembly charge.

Cost can vary by region but the above amount is probably ball park accurate.

 

[PR_SMITH]

Locally, shops charge about $50 for an initial O2 cleaning on a single tank and one of the local shops charges half that for subsequent cleanings the following years.

Doubles are twice that plus a $25 disassembly/assembly charge.

Cost can vary by region but the above amount is probably ball park accurate.

I took the bands and manifold apart myself, LDS said that would save a few $$.

Does O2 cleaning simply involve some sort of solvent wash? As I understand it, the idea is to eliminate any hydrocarbon material that could react with the oxygen?

 

[oxyhacker]

Yeah. I tend to hate hydros, since I do my own visuals but have to drive an hour for a (highly entertaining, I will admit) hydro. But if you think about it, the cost of hydros is actually less per year than the price of visuals these days, if we figure $40 for a hydro and $10 for a visual. So from your point of view, throwing away 1/5th or so of a hydro, to gain 1/2 of a visual, is not unreasonable, when you add in the convenience of not having to leave the tank again. So you have done nothing stupid.

So if you did it on the basis of that math, then you have done nothing stupid. But if you did it because the dive ship convinced you that it was somehow necessary to have the hydro schedule perfectly in synch with the visual statement, then you have been suckered, but a shop that hasn't a clue about the actual rules.

I suppose that I could have got my vis at that time, but then I would have to leave it a the dive shop for the hydro later in the year. The headache is that there is not a LDS in the town I live and more often than not I cannot get my tanks serviced the same time I am down there (1 hour away). And then when I do go diving, I do not want the air station (not a shop that can vis or hydro) to deny me air - so the headache is trying to get everything in synch.

But as I said and my point was - my LDS and the local air stations will not fill if you need either a vis or hydro.