US Divers Metal second stages, Why not?

[John C. Ratliff]

My grandfather did have a place there decades ago after they lost their home in Camille in Waveland. I forget which hurricane took out the (new) place in Keaton Beach. We have hauled our boat down there many a time for fishing since over the years and rented cabins at the Hag. I also have dived there of course. And spear fished and with a two screw 1085 to boot. I would have a story on my gf, a bull shark and me in the water solo spearing with a pole spear. but I would get banned and PETA would not like me anymore . Friends in Perry, do not hate on me, but y'alls might be the red neck capital of the planet .

I a still waiting for Mr. John's run times with the straw. In fact, just put on a scuba tank and breathe through the 1085 in Navy frogman boots and take a run down the road. The locals would think nothing of him jogging down the road in full scuba kit, just a regular day for Mr. John, they just figure his car broke down so he just take a run down to the local get wet spot . That would be some good high altitude training for climbing.

I had the real fun of diving with an actual "operator" in Cozumel this trip for several days! Dude was good!!!!!!!!!!! And I am not being sarcastic, he was a superb diver and he was at home in the water, great buddy as he had a camera rig too! Fun!

Nemrod,

I'll do you one better. I have a writeup of my dive on May 17, 2007 which used the first generation Calypso and had the second generation Calypso, with the screw-on exhaust. I actually addressed some of what you are concerned about in that dive debriefing sheet. But first, let me say that the breathing through a straw is not the same as breathing through the second generation Calypso (the openings are much different). So here's my writeup of that dive:

Date: May 17, 2007
Dive Site: High Rocks, Clackamas River
Entrance Time: 3:15 PM Exit Time: 3:45 PM Bottom Time: 30 minutes

Dive Plan:

I had to get gas for my rig in the morning, and paid about $60 for a tank full. I was therefore going to try to get a second dive, and had thrown in my single AL 80 and the Calypso regulator that I had build over the last winter from two regulators, one I got off e-bay for about $25 and one I got at the LDS for $10. I used the second generation LP hose and a special fitting for the LP outlet on the Calypso on the first stage, which allowed me to use a LP splitter and get two extra LP outlets. I used one for the second generation Calypso second stage, which has a neck strap, and the other for an LP fitting for my Para-Sea BC. I was using the original Calypso regulator, with the metal exhaust and the diaphragm exhaust valve, as my primary regulator, mounted on a long hose. It was on the downward-angled LP outlet, and went across my body, behind my head, and down my right side in an ideal position, DIR fashion. (I wonder what the DIR fellows would say about a 1962 Calypso set up for DIR diving?) My plan was to use this configuration for the first time in open water (it’s been pool-tested twice). I also wanted to evaluate the scoop fins I had made against the Mares Quattro Excel that I bought for my Christmas present last winter.

Observations

My primary objectives here were to ensure that the Calypso regulator was functioning well, and so I stayed shallow for a few minutes to test the regulator. It was functioning flawlessly. Breathing took very little effort, and even for the small exhaust in the diaphragm, I did not experience any restriction in exhalation effort. This is probably because this exhaust is directly in the path of the air from the mouth, and all it has to do on exhalation is open the exhaust mushroom in the diaphragm. This is exactly the same experience I had when I switched between two dives in one day in the early 1970s between a Dacor R-4 that I had built up from scratch, to a Voit V-11 Viking 40, which is the Voit equivalent of the Calypso.

I moved out of the shallow, tracing exactly the same route I had previously done with my twin 45s and Mistral on the earlier dive. My scoop fins were wonderful, and I still think they are better than anything that Mares has ever produced. I was thinking that the Quattro Excel, because they use the same concept, would be very good, and they are, but again Mares has not implemented the design in its truest form. The center of the Quattro Excel still has significant resistance, and that inhibits the scooping action that the blade should be producing. Using my own design shows that the fin is much easier to push through the water, without any loss of power.

I found the tree, and looked over the dead Chinook salmon. There were more downstream too. Then I worked the current a bit, and enjoyed the increase in streamlining of the single AL 80 verses the twin 45s. In the deeper area, I looked at my SPG (this time a 1970s USD single gauge at the end of the HP line, instead of my state-of-the-art Suunto Cobra). It read about 2500 psi. I looked over the area, and found more Chinook smolt. There is rebar on the bottom, sticking out, and in the current I grabbed ahold of it to provide stability, and watched the fish. If I held my breath, they came in closely, and that when I saw the bars on their sides which showed them to be Chinook smolt.

Still holding onto rebar in the Current, I tested the Calypso’s exhaust characteristics. I have a small book, the golden guide to scuba diving, Handbook of Underwater Activities by Wheeler J. North, a legendary diver from the 1960s. It shows the original Calypso being used, as well as double hose regs too. Somewhere in that book, Wheeler J. North states that this regulator is prone to flooding in a current, due to the design of the exhaust. But try as I might, no head position would put a current through the exhaust ports that unseated the mushroom valve and allowed even a little water in. So I think that assessment was not correct

I released, and swam leisurely downstream. I had already heard a couple of river boats go over me, and so I kept deep. I don’t dive a dive flag, as I tried that (see some past dive logs) and found that a dive flag on a float was not compatible with the types of current I was experiencing in the spring runoffs of the Clackamas River. When I got to my exit point, I saw that a new fisherman was there. I had again collected a few lures, and once I got my knees under me and crawled out onto the rock, gave them to him. But he was not too interested.

We were talking, and I put my fins, mask, helmet and gloves onto my BC (I have a special loop for this), preparing to go back to the car. A river boat zoomed past us, and I did not pay much attention to it until a few seconds later, when I heard a “thud,” and then another “thud” against rocks. I said, “That doesn’t sound good,” and looked downstream. The river boat was on its side, a few hundred yards below us. It had hit a rock at speed, lost control, careened into the bank, and turned on its side. It’s bow was sticking up, and stern submerged in the water. I told the fisherman, “I think I’ll put my fins back on, and see whether they need help picking up lost gear.” So I sat back down, took my fins off the BC, put them on, then my mask, then my helmet and finally my gloves (the water was about 50 degrees F). I was ready for my third dive of the day…

That third dive involved me drifting down current on my snorkel to find that the river boat on its side had trapped an older gentleman. The boat was on its side, with its open side upstream, gathering a lot of water current which pushed it up against some rocks. One of those rocks held the older gentleman's ankle between the rock and the boat's gunwale. The current was pushing the boat very hard against the rocks. I asked if they needed help, and they told me about the older gentleman trapped by the boat. So I got up in the water, and walked over to the boat's downstream side by its bow (which was near the shore). I tried lifting it, and could not against the current. I asked the others to come to the bow, and help me lift on the bow. They did, but again the current worked against us. There was a tremendous push by the current against the open boat. But what I did observe was that when we lifted, it created a wave in the current stream holding the boat to the rocks. So I lifted again, and again noted the wave forming at the bow, and traveling down to the stern sticking out into he current. Well, I asked the others to come and help me lift in unison so as to create a series of waves along the stream's water backflow. We did, and the wave kept getting bigger as we lifted in unison. We lifted harder and harder, and created large waves, and after several minutes of doing this, one large wave we created traveled down and loosened the river's give on the older gentleman's leg, whereby he pulled the leg free. We had done it...he was free!

By that time the Clackamas police were there, and I talked to the officer in charge, telling him what we had done. I was still in my full wetsuit, with my single tank and weights. After he had taken his notes for his report, including my name and address, I was getting warm and decided to walk back up to my car, where I got out of my gear, and drove home.

At home, I received a phone call from one of the news channels, and they wanted to come out to my home and interview me. I said that would be okay, and I did get a short moment in the local TV news that day.

John

 

[Scott G. Bonser]

Nemrod,

I'll do you one better. I have a writeup of my dive on May 17, 2007 which used the first generation Calypso and had the second generation Calypso, with the screw-on exhaust. I actually addressed some of what you are concerned about in that dive debriefing sheet. But first, let me say that the breathing through a straw is not the same as breathing through the second generation Calypso (the openings are much different). So here's my writeup of that dive:

That third dive involved me drifting down current on my snorkel to find that the river boat on its side had trapped an older gentleman. The boat was on its side, with its open side upstream, gathering a lot of water current which pushed it up against some rocks. One of those rocks held the older gentleman's ankle between the rock and the boat's gunwale. The current was pushing the boat very hard against the rocks. I asked if they needed help, and they told me about the older gentleman trapped by the boat. So I got up in the water, and walked over to the boat's downstream side by its bow (which was near the shore). I tried lifting it, and could not against the current. I asked the others to come to the bow, and help me lift on the bow. They did, but again the current worked against us. There was a tremendous push by the current against the open boat. But what I did observe was that when we lifted, it created a wave in the current stream holding the boat to the rocks. So I lifted again, and again noted the wave forming at the bow, and traveling down to the stern sticking out into he current. Well, I asked the others to come and help me lift in unison so as to create a series of waves along the stream's water backflow. We did, and the wave kept getting bigger as we lifted in unison. We lifted harder and harder, and created large waves, and after several minutes of doing this, one large wave we created traveled down and loosened the river's give on the older gentleman's leg, whereby he pulled the leg free. We had done it...he was free!

By that time the Clackamas police were there, and I talked to the officer in charge, telling him what we had done. I was still in my full wetsuit, with my single tank and weights. After he had taken his notes for his report, including my name and address, I was getting warm and decided to walk back up to my car, where I got out of my gear, and drove home.

At home, I received a phone call from one of the news channels, and they wanted to come out to my home and interview me. I said that would be okay, and I did get a short moment in the local TV news that day.

John

Excellent works John, You were in the right place at the right time…. It happens that way sometimes. … regulator still working well too…

 

[AFdivedoc]

I'm just reading through this thread from the beginning. The following quote from the OP from page 1 caught my eye:

"on top of that, my home shop says they will not service the conshelf second stages anyway, saying something about Aqua Lung calling an end of life for those models."

This is laughable, since a version of that regulator is still in production, used heavily by military and commercial divers. I believe the current version of the metal 1085 does have a port opposite the inlet fitting to make adjustment easier. Those new regs actually sell for a pretty penny.

Aqua Lung 1081-00 Conshelf XIV Regulator - 1st/2nd Stage

Aqua Lung Conshelf XIV Regulator 1st/2nd Stage 1081-00 is built for exceptional durability and continues to be the world's most popular Military and Professional Operations regulator.

www.amronintl.com

It is unusual to find a metal 1085 that can't be restored to service. On the other hand, I toss the body of most second hand plastic Conshelfs out as soon as I see hairline cracks around the inlet fittings, and salvage the internal parts for my 1085 spare parts bin.

I recently went on a dive trip to the Great Lakes where one of my dive buddies complained that his LDS told him his Scubapro 109s were obsolete and he needed to get new regs. He did so, and he left the old reg with the LDS believing they were not worth anything. He really regretted it when I told him that current Scubapro internal parts are compatible with his old second stage reg, and that soft parts can be found with some looking.

My go-to travel regs are Scubapro Mk-5 first stage with 108/109 seconds or G250/G200 seconds, and a Conshelf first and 1085 seconds. I work some Poseidons in there as well.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I'm just reading through this thread from the beginning. The following quote from the OP from page 1 caught my eye:

"on top of that, my home shop says they will not service the conshelf second stages anyway, saying something about Aqua Lung calling an end of life for those models."

This is laughable, since a version of that regulator is still in production, used heavily by military and commercial divers. I believe the current version of the metal 1085 does have a port opposite the inlet fitting to make adjustment easier. Those new regs actually sell for a pretty penny.

Aqua Lung 1081-00 Conshelf XIV Regulator - 1st/2nd Stage

Aqua Lung Conshelf XIV Regulator 1st/2nd Stage 1081-00 is built for exceptional durability and continues to be the world's most popular Military and Professional Operations regulator.

www.amronintl.com

It is unusual to find a metal 1085 that can't be restored to service. On the other hand, I toss the body of most second hand plastic Conshelfs out as soon as I see hairline cracks around the inlet fittings, and salvage the internal parts for my 1085 spare parts bin.

I recently went on a dive trip to the Great Lakes where one of my dive buddies complained that his LDS told him his Scubapro 109s were obsolete and he needed to get new regs. He did so, and he left the old reg with the LDS believing they were not worth anything. He really regretted it when I told him that current Scubapro internal parts are compatible with his old second stage reg, and that soft parts can be found with some looking.

My go-to travel regs are Scubapro Mk-5 first stage with 108/109 seconds or G250/G200 seconds, and a Conshelf first and 1085 seconds. I work some Poseidons in there as well.

One of the sleaziest things I ever witnessed was when I was in a dive shop many years ago, and a guy comes in with an older set of Scubapro regs, all metal. At the time I didn’t know what they were but now I know they had to be 108/109/109 balanced adjustable/156/ MK5/MK10? (Any of the above)
I heard the guy behind the counter (long since gone now) telling the customer that his set was obsolete and couldn’t be serviced. The service guy then told him they were worthless but he’d take them off his hands if he wanted. The customer fell for it and gave him the regs! If I knew then what I know now I would have dove in the way and offered him $100 on the spot.
It turns out the service guy was a collector and wanted the regs for himself. What a turd!