Unknown Tourist dead, Dive Master ill - Ambergris Caye, Belize

[DandyDon]

It's a difficult read in some respects ... and brings back some memories of a similar incident in Roatan several years ago. I had just dived at the resort and shortly after returning home read about the death of the DM we'd had, along with another client.

The tourist was from Texas if I remember the same event. The very popular resort tried to blame the tourist for the DM's death and that got some traction at first, but the resort eventually settled with the widow and admitted to CO tainted tanks. Later on I enjoyed an informative visit with a dive boat captain who'd discovered the faulty compressor.

 

[boulderjohn]

Can we start some like of "warning list" or "balcklist" of known terrible operators with deaths and coverups? More of a "Buyer-beware" type thing?

Yes, there are some operations to watch out for, but creating such a list is a problem.

1. Deaths due to such operator errors are very rare.
2. Deaths due to natural causes, such as a heart attack, are much more common. That is the biggest category in causes of death.
3. In a surprisingly high percentage of cases, the cause of death is undetermined. In the case of a friend of mine, the death defies all attempts at explanation, and it was as thoroughly examined as possible.
4. In all cases, fatalities during scuba are very rare, so even the shakiest of operators will have a pretty good record overall.
5. The number of fatalities in a shop's history will depend in large part on the number of divers it hosts. If all things are equal, a large shop with many boats will have more fatalities than a small shop with one boat.
6. Putting the preceding 5 together, an excellent shop can have a higher number of fatalities than a shady operation--even much higher. It would be very easy to put an outstanding operation on such a list while missing a truly bad one next door.
7. Listing a shop as being risky and one to avoid can create legal issues, even if the listing is correct. Ask ScubaBoard veterans, including Dandy Don, about the major ScubaBoard lawsuit stemming from a thread about a dive operation that did indeed have a serious problem that caused a fatality.
8. Because fatalities are so rare, a very bad operator will have scads and scads of happy customers praising them, more than enough to offset negative reviews. We just had a thread about that ended up with the operator being expelled from PADI. Its TripAdvisor page is completely flooded with rave reviews, without a bad one in sight.

What follows is intentionally vague for reasons that should be obvious. I know an operation that gets rave reviews and is highly recommended on ScubaBoard. I used it years ago but stopped because I had a variety of concerns. Like many operations around the world, it has the word "dive" in its name. Another dive operation owner in that area told me that in that area, the other operator staff members usually use the word "die" instead of "dive" when speaking of them.

 

[DandyDon]

In a surprisingly high percentage of cases, the cause of death is undetermined.

Yep, no one knows how many die from bad air as they're usually written off as drowning. Nondivers see us as dangerous sport participants and easily accept our deaths if they don't know the deceased.

Listing a shop as being risky and one to avoid can create legal issues, even if the listing is correct. Ask ScubaBoard veterans, including Dandy Don, about the major ScubaBoard lawsuit stemming from a thread about a dive operation that did indeed have a serious problem that caused a fatality.

Yep, the lawsuit was thrown out when it got to court, but was expensive to deal with. I was named personally and was certainly worried.

Besides, shops change constantly, for better or worse. Records don't mean much. Test every tank and cover your own ass.

 

[A Bajo]

So let me ask this. What do those who take a co detector do on a recreational trip. Test their tank each time like you test for Nitrox.

 

[DaveWKC]

I totally get what you're saying here - especially the low ratios of accidents for a particular operator. But, the way that I am thinking of it is that the true measure of the integrity of an operator is how they behave when something goes wrong. And, from an absolute newb lens, I see several suspicious things here - namely a camera being cut, a missing SD card, and 3+ hours to deliver a tank for inspection.

I'll drop it, but I could see value in manicuring the outright suspicious behaviors of operators and presenting the data in a way that allows for others to make their own conclusions.

 

[DandyDon]

So let me ask this. What do those who take a co detector do on a recreational trip. Test their tank each time like you test for Nitrox.

Yep!​

 

[Rafael Moreira]

Yep!​

Can I ask you, from all tanks that you tested for CO, how often do you find readings?

 

[boulderjohn]

I totally get what you're saying here - especially the low ratios of accidents for a particular operator. But, the way that I am thinking of it is that the true measure of the integrity of an operator is how they behave when something goes wrong. And, from an absolute newb lens, I see several suspicious things here - namely a camera being cut, a missing SD card, and 3+ hours to deliver a tank for inspection.

I'll drop it, but I could see value in manicuring the outright suspicious behaviors of operators and presenting the data in a way that allows for others to make their own conclusions.

In 2003, Tina Watson died in strange circumstances in Australia. He husband, Gabe, was blamed, largely because of the highly suspicious details that were reported. To cut to the chase, most of those details turned out to be untrue. When he was eventually tried for murder in Alabama, expert witnesses were on hand prepared to testify for the defense, but they never got a chance because the judge threw the case out out after the prosecution was done. For the internet divers reading all the lurid details online, he was obviously guilty; in a court of law requiring real evidence, the case was laughable.

 

[DandyDon]

Can I ask you, from all tanks that you tested for CO, how often do you find readings?

A few, not many, but then I'm an old coot and don't make as many trips so my results aren't very relevant. But then, even a few small hits are noteworthy.

 

[rmssetc]

So let me ask this. What do those who take a co detector do on a recreational trip. Test their tank each time like you test for Nitrox.

Yes, of course.